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Forum LockedThe magyarabs of Egypt

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gerik View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07-Nov-2005 at 09:37


When we met the magyarab or magarab word we tend to suppose that
the word is made up of the words: magyar and arab,but in fact magyarab means magyar tribe and not hungarian arab,ab meaning in local languages tribe.

 The magyarabs are a people living in Egypt,near the border of Egypt and Sudan , they  consider themselves hungarians. In their legend of origin they regard as their ancestors the hungarian soldiers fighting in the ottoman army at the beginning of 16th century (whose leader was Ibrahim el-Magyar or Hasan el-Magyar,the time when I Selim conquered Egypt) and berber wemen.  Their  mother  language was  berber,but  due  to arabization now is arabic.
There have been   made  some documentarie films  about  them.

Count  Almásy László  led a dozen of expeditions into Egypt,Sudan and Libia in the twenties and thirties of  the 20th century . During these he met the representatives of the magyarab tribe in Nubia.
The magyarabs tried to send some delegates to Hungary,but because of the second world war they did not succeded.


The people we are talking about have european features,and lighter skin than other people from that region.
This does not prove anything yet. Their different origin is remembered also by their neighbours,who have proverbs regarding them: "The magyar does not pray in mosque", "The magyar  wears hat",so not turban like nubians, one regarding stubborness "The magyars have hard head like stone". They have the custom to draw a cross on the bread when they bake it,the same custom existed in Hungary also. They also draw a sign of cross on the forehead of a newborn child,though they are muslim.So their ancestors were christians when they arrived in Egist.

Also there is the group of magyarabs from Asuan . According to the narration of the assuan group they arrived in the time of Maria Teresia , they were muslim hungarians who refused to be rechristened,and because of these they were expelled.

According to the french nurses working in a hospital in Assuan the magyarabs have different blood group,so they can easily identify who is magyarab .

There are some people in Hungary who deny their hungarian origin.
But then what would be a reason for them to declare themselves hungarian,to link themselves to a country about which they have never learned? To every visitor they mention that they are hungarians,and they originate from Hungary.
There is no selfish reason!

Hungary is a poor country,people motivated by money would have chosen a rich or powerfull country!






Source:
Magyarab - Wikipédia-Magyarabs
Világvevő - Magyarabok -Magyarabs
Demokrata magazine-1997
Workshop-Hungarians from the Nile region - MŰHELY Magyarok a Nílus mentén
http://w3.datanet.hu/~demokrat/muh1-429.htm

"A bőrszín megváltozhat, a magyar nyelv elveszhet, de a nemzethez való tartozás tudata egy távoli, idegen környezetben is fennmaradhat"

"The colour of skin may change,the hungarian language could be lost,but
the consciousness of belonging to the nation can survive even in a distant
and alien environment"

Hungarian radio:
A magyarabok
 





Edited by gerik
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OSMANLI View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OSMANLI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Nov-2005 at 15:26
Very interesting. How come they only see themselves as Magyar and not as Berber?

"Freedom for the right of the Headscarf"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote minchickie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Nov-2005 at 20:18
This is very interesting! Ive never heard of this before. Glad to learn something new about Magyars!
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Nagyfejedelem View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nagyfejedelem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Nov-2005 at 03:29
Half thousand years is a very long time but they didn't louse their identity!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Nov-2005 at 07:24

Originally posted by Nagyfejedelem Nagyfejedelem wrote:

Half thousand years is a very long time but they didn't louse their identity!
well something typical Magyar huh?  

Turks did rule there about 500 years (mamlukes + Ottomans) i didnt heard of any Turkic village or a groop or something so far, maybe it exists but who knows...

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gerik View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Nov-2005 at 03:15
In the time of the first World War when Great Britain declared Egypt
as their protactorate they started to persecute the magyarab comunity,because they declared themselves unambigously hungarian.
Great Britain was in war with Austria-Hungary and with the Ottoman empire,
and because of this they interned a  part  of  magyarabs.
According  to  their telling  they did  not  deny  their  identity  even  in  the relocation  camp.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Nov-2005 at 06:41
Originally posted by gerik gerik wrote:

In the time of the first World War when Great Britain declared Egypt
as their protactorate they started to persecute the magyarab comunity,because they declared themselves unambigously hungarian.
Great Britain was in war with Austria-Hungary and with the Ottoman empire,
and because of this they interned a  part  of  magyarabs.
According  to  their telling  they did  not  deny  their  identity  even  in  the relocation  camp.
It is strange. I am sure that they are/were not a security risk at all. They know their roots, but I think they are assimilated to their homeland.
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gerik View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Nov-2005 at 07:23
Nobody denies the fact that the magyarabs have assimilated to sorrounding
nubians and arabs by culture,religion  and customs  but  they  have also  certain features which  makes them different.
Count Almásy was the first hungarian  who encountered them in  the 20th century and in a book appeared in 1937 has a full chapter about his visit
in Vadi Halfa and in the island Magyararti (an island on the Nile owned only by magyarabs which now not exist because of the gate from Assuan).

They  told to Almasy:
"After that our ancestors have taken as their wife berber wemen and learned from them the berber language,and beside arabic we speak this. We know that in Europe exist hungarian people . They are our brothers
and we always wanted somebody from them visit us"





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gerik View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2005 at 08:05
On their different customs:
As I wrote in my first post on magyarabs:
They have the custom to draw a cross on the bread when they bake it,the same custom existed in Hungary also. They also draw a sign of cross on the forehead of a newborn child,though they are muslim.

They pronounce simmilarly the gy consonant existing in hungarian (gy is soft "g", like in "during", "due", more like a palatelised d , it is not like the english j[ʤ] in the word jungle,for that hungarian is using dzs which a rare sound in hungarian). The gy consonant  is existing also in the arabic spoken in Sudan, which is pronounced  in  the literary arab  language like the hungarian dzs.

Even those magyarabs who are not speaking the nubian dialect and using
the dzs[ʤ] pronounciation (and not using gy),they make an exception when they are referring to themselves using the pronounciation with  gy for the magyarab word.

The arab word used for hungarian is majary, (in hungarian trancription mádzsári, mágári, mágyári)  pronounced  with   j[ʤ],  g  (like in gun) or gy depending if literary arab, egyptian or sudanese dialect is spoken.

The magyarabs from Nubia (ones alike speaking nubian or arabic as their mother language) are saying "ana magyar"=I am hungarian or "ana  ragil magyar"=I am a hungarian man.








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Death Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Apr-2006 at 11:04
Could you be more specific as to where these people live.I am very interested.What town or city or wilage or region?
Tell me once again from when those Magyars live there(lol, i already call them Magyars,hihihihi)
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