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Parnell ![]() Chieftain ![]() ![]() Joined: 04-Apr-2007 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 1365 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 16-Jun-2009 at 14:58 |
I'm a bit shaky on all of this but the medieval Italian city states were by far my most favourite area of medieval European history. Venice, Genoa, Pisa and Florence seemed to have some sort of voting system. They formed 'communes', in which the merchant class elected their own members to their legislative organs. Cities like Florence fluctuated, especially in the Renaissance, between Republican government and autocracy. These cities had a huge trading class who more or less dominated the mediterranean trade (Byzantium in decline, the Fatimids rather impotent beyond their own borders etc.) Provence in southern France could boast a few wealthy city states like Marseilles. I'm not sure about their system of government. If I remember right though the Venetian Doge was hereditary but sat over a Senate which was elective. In Rome for example in the mid 12th century, a commune had ousted the Pope and ran the city for themselves. These occurances were not irregular in Italy. The Normans in southern Italy were much more autocratic, ruling more under a system of military fiefs like the kind you would see in france. |
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"Neither apathy nor antipathy can ever bring out the truth of history" Eoin Mac Neill.
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fantasus ![]() Samurai ![]() ![]() Joined: 07-May-2009 Location: denmark Status: Offline Points: 111 |
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Democracy in modern sense, is it not, well, very "modern"- or recent?
How big part of populations had full rights,(including political, voting) in 19.th century, not in the authocracies, but in most "liberal" countries like US of A and Britain? perhaps a few percent.
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gcle2003 ![]() Immortal Guard ![]() ![]() Joined: 06-Dec-2004 Location: Luxembourg Status: Offline Points: 7011 |
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Plus ça change....
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Citizen of Ankh-Morpork
Never believe anything until it has been officially denied - Sir Humphrey Appleby, 1984. |
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calvo ![]() General ![]() Joined: 20-May-2007 Location: Spain Status: Offline Points: 848 |
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Did they have any voting system? If yes, who was entitled to vote?
Did these republics have anything in common with the republics that emerged after the independence of USA and the French Revolution? |
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Parnell ![]() Chieftain ![]() ![]() Joined: 04-Apr-2007 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 1365 |
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The medieval Italian republics were not democratic in any meaningful modern sense. It was essentially the rule of the trading interests (The burgesses) Its no coincidence that this form of government was preferred in these booming trading towns over monarchies.
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"Neither apathy nor antipathy can ever bring out the truth of history" Eoin Mac Neill.
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Al Jassas ![]() Arch Duke ![]() Joined: 07-Aug-2007 Status: Offline Points: 1809 |
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I have been asking the same question for some time. Republicanism isn't foreign in europe, many cities were "independent cities" with their own senates and heads especially those involved with trade. Almost all the Hanza cities were like this. What made Venice et al so special is that these were empires or semi empires not just ruling their immediate vicinity. What I found from the little I researched is that they were oligarchies, only rich and powerful residents of the cities themselves ruled them. Franchise was limited and was modeled on the Roman model (grouping people into classes with a certain weight according to wealth). Al-Jassas
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calvo ![]() General ![]() Joined: 20-May-2007 Location: Spain Status: Offline Points: 848 |
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WELCOME, OUR CURRENTLY ACTIVE FORUM HAS MOVED OVER TO:
http://allempires.net/forum/forums.html , ADMINISTRATION Many of the states in late medieval Italy, such as Genoa and Venice, were republics. Were they real democracies in that all citizens could vote, or only the aristocracy could have a say in politics? Were their constitutions similar to that of the Roman republic? Edited by Seko - 14-Jan-2010 at 20:17 |
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