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Forum LockedSieg Heil Jihad?

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Carpathian Wolf View Drop Down
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    Posted: 02-Oct-2008 at 05:25
http://www.sullivan-county.com/images/nazis_islam.jpg
 
 
I keep seeing Mujehadeen using this hand motion...can someone explain this to me?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JanusRook Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Oct-2008 at 17:36
It's a traditional salute used in many cultures. It doesn't necessarily have to have Nazi or anti-semetic tones with it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Oct-2008 at 18:34
Not Nazi or anti-semitic. It looks like a Roman salute for instance.
 
But the way in which everyone is giving the same salute the same way at the same time is kind of fascistic, or at least obsessively militaristic.
 
Not the kind of demonstration I'd want to be associated with.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote xi_tujue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02-Oct-2008 at 19:03
Zieg heil means hail to victory I don't see what the problem is

it's the same with the swastika

ignorance is the real problem
I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carpathian Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Oct-2008 at 22:23
I know it's a Roman salut.
 
I know the swastika in europe has Thracian roots and in the east Buddhist.
 
I just never knew the salute was part of the Islamic culture in any way. Does anyone have more information on this? What other cultures used this salut all over the world?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Oct-2008 at 22:57
Originally posted by gcle2003 gcle2003 wrote:

Not Nazi or anti-semitic. It looks like a Roman salute for instance.
 
 
Nazi salute is exactly the same with the Roman salute. Smile


Edited by Sarmat12 - 04-Oct-2008 at 04:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IamJoseph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 03:18
Its a form of bad manners and assumed despotism. Pointing the finger is in the same category.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IamJoseph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 03:39
Quote I just never knew the salute was part of the Islamic culture in any way. Does anyone have more information on this? What other cultures used this salut all over the world?
 
Both the Romans and the Nazis used an eagle as their ensign. Roman Catholicism took on that name as its prefix, and it ended in the Holocaust. A large group of Islamists [The Brotherhood] sided with the Nazis in W.W.11, and ended up with a Nazi-like aspiration for Jews. Today, Muslims deny all blatant historical facts - and worship Christian falsehoods like Blood Libels and The Protocols - and Christians are silent of it - the Pope even shakes hands with guys like Arafat, condoning the term Palestinians on him. Wow.
 
There must be something these groups are guilty of - why else would they be so obsessed like their very existence and beliefs become threatened by a miniscule group such as Jews existing - why would they foster so much lies and deny or remain silent when truth is flaunted so blatantly. How can the truth set this lot free?
 
The dead giveaway was accusing a people of deicide [sic], and claiming the OT is distorted and correct by the Quran which appeared 2500 years later, when no Arabic existed till 350 CE and no one in the world believes this other than those enforced by the sword.
 
The funniest part is they don't realise but for the Jewish scapegoat - they would have to face each other off in a mutually exclusive situation. And I want front row seats when this drama is played out.
 
Another dead give away is both dream and wish for their preferred Messengers/Saviers to return - as if this would make any difference. Christians would not believe Mohammed, and Muslims would not Believe Jesus - this has factual precedence in history - why wish for a repeat performance? Had any of these groups been genuine, they would wish for Moses to return - the only one who can attest or deny what they claim of Moses' revelation to humanity. But Moses was not present when they beat their chests shouting I AM THE GREATEST. Whereas Moses had God present when he said anything.
 
Worshiping an eagle or any other image is the wrong path: you end up worshipping falsehood - and thinking the images cannot see, talk or hear you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beylerbeyi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 13:41
Quote I keep seeing Mujehadeen using this hand motion...can someone explain this to me?


I've never any Muslim do this before (I come from a Muslim country). Stop getting your news form Balkan fascist websites and you won't see it either.

Quote Zieg heil means hail to victory I don't see what the problem is
it's the same with the swastika


Is this serious or are you trolling?

Quote Both the Romans and the Nazis used an eagle as their ensign. Roman Catholicism took on that name as its prefix, and it ended in the Holocaust.


Many people used eagle in history. US uses eagle. There is no causal link between the Romans and genocide of Jews by Germans.

Quote Today, Muslims deny all blatant historical facts - and worship Christian falsehoods like Blood Libels and The Protocols - and Christians are silent of it - the Pope even shakes hands with guys like Arafat, condoning the term Palestinians on him. Wow.


Muslims deny facts and worship the Protocols? Surely vast majority of Muslims have never even heard of these.

I am also disgusted by Arafat shaking hands with the Pope. Arafat was a secularist freedom fighter and that Pope was a high-grade SOB. I don't understand what 'condoning the term Palestinians on him' means? Palestinians are Palestinians no matter what the Pope says.

Quote The dead giveaway was accusing a people of deicide [sic], and claiming the OT is distorted and correct by the Quran which appeared 2500 years later, when no Arabic existed till 350 CE and no one in the world believes this other than those enforced by the sword. ...  Another dead give away is both dream and wish for their preferred Messengers/Saviers to return - as if this would make any difference. Christians would not believe Mohammed, and Muslims would not Believe Jesus - this has factual precedence in history - why wish for a repeat performance? Had any of these groups been genuine, they would wish for Moses to return - the only one who can attest or deny what they claim of Moses' revelation to humanity. But Moses was not present when they beat their chests shouting I AM THE GREATEST. Whereas Moses had God present when he said anything.


From a historical point of view, vast majority of the people who believe in Islam today descend from people who voluntarily converted to that religion.

Not that it matters, really, but you have no idea whatsoever on Muslim beliefs. I am not going to correct you, since I am not Muslim. I'll just mention that it is pathetic that you claim Muslims worship Christian libels about the Jews, while at the same time you spew Christian lies 'Islam spread by sword', 'Muslims believe Mohammed will come back'  etc yourself.


Edited by Beylerbeyi - 04-Oct-2008 at 13:45
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IamJoseph Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 14:07

Quote Many people used eagle in history. US uses eagle. There is no causal link between the Romans and genocide of Jews by Germans.
 
America faught against the nazis in W.W.11, while large sectors of Arab Muslims joined the Nazi party at this time [The Brotherhood]. US usage of the eagle was incidental, and unconnected with the European Romans; the Arabs alligned with the third reich by choice. There is a denial in your responsa.
 


 
Quote

Muslims deny facts and worship the Protocols? Surely vast majority of Muslims have never even heard of these.
 
There is obviously no good muslim majority when the teachings of the Protocols are so widespread, blatant and impudent: in Madarassas, islamic websites, media, billboards, and TV series.
Quote
I am also disgusted by Arafat shaking hands with the Pope. Arafat was a secularist freedom fighter and that Pope was a high-grade SOB. I don't understand what 'condoning the term Palestinians on him' means? Palestinians are Palestinians no matter what the Pope says.
 
Secularist? He was a serial mass murderer, an Egyptian who followed Haj Hamim, who converted to the Nazi ideology. Both  the Pope and Arafat was engaged in genocide of the Jewish nation and state: I don't see Arafat as a freedom fighter - I wonder what he thought was the jewish homeland? Never mind Arafat as a freedom fighter; muslims openly protect and reverse a mass murderer like Bin Laden, never criticise him by name, did not issue a Fatwah for his arrest, and made him into a neo islamic savier.
 
Quote

From a historical point of view, vast majority of the people who believe in Islam today descend from people who voluntarily converted to that religion.
 
We read different history books.
 
Quote

Not that it matters, really, but you have no idea whatsoever on Muslim beliefs. I am not going to correct you, since I am not Muslim. I'll just mention that it is pathetic that you claim Muslims worship Christian libels about the Jews, while at the same time you spew Christian lies 'Islam spread by sword', 'Muslims believe Mohammed will come back'  etc yourself.
 
They may not wait for Mohammed, but the same applies for any messenger waited for. If the topic relates to the Hebrew Bible - only Moses can vouch for it. And of course Muslims believe in some 50% of the Gospel's stories, including immaculate birth. They reject the resurrection. This means if one is wrong - both are wrong in one swell swoop, by reason each has condoned a writings which was wrong.
 
Both Christianity and Islam spread by the rake and sword respectively; Christianity has only been stemmed recently, with the development of American Christianity, which is vested with laws of equality and inalienable human rights - aka the Constitution. That enforced conversions come to naught is seen by the state of Islam today, and the decent of Europe.  Belief is one place where size does not matter.




Edited by IamJoseph - 04-Oct-2008 at 14:11
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote es_bih Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 16:11
Originally posted by Beylerbeyi Beylerbeyi wrote:



I've never any Muslim do this before (I come from a Muslim country). Stop getting your news form Balkan fascist websites and you won't see it either.



LOL

I must say I agree.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote es_bih Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 16:14
Originally posted by IamJoseph IamJoseph wrote:


Secularist? He was a serial mass murderer,


Uhm... you sure you don't mean just about every Isreali high official since the forties?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote es_bih Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 16:18
Judaism had its share of putting people to the sword if you read your Bible/ Old Testament in the same manner you judge the other two faiths. That is in an illogical fashion of course.

Islam the religion and Muslims the followers are two things. Islam the religion may say do not do this, but a Muslim may still do it out of sheer will (freedom of choice we humans have, have we not), ignorance, stupidity, etc...

Same goes for Christianity.


...or Judaism for that matter.

If I am not mistaken you could then say Judaism causes countless deaths when you take into consideration that the Isreali army shells innocent civilans on a weekly basis, and thinks this is a way to stave off "extremism." Now how does that relate to Judaism? Aside that the people doing it are at least nominal Jews. Not much aside from that fact.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote malizai_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 17:45

It should not be assumed a salute. It is most likely an oath taking, most likelyhood of being 'bayah' or allegiance.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sparten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 21:01
Oath taking is done the same way in Pakistan. New recruits to my dads regiment are sworn in the same way, a regiment that fought against Nazis at E Alamein and at Monte Cassino.
The Germans also take vacations in Paris; especially during the periods they call "blitzkrieg".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carpathian Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Oct-2008 at 23:44

First off I just went to google, image and then "nazi salute" and I got that website.

 
I didn't go to any Balkan website or whatever non sense you two are trying to spoute for lack of an arguement.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote malizai_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Oct-2008 at 01:23

??Confused

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Oct-2008 at 17:55
Hello to you all
 
First about the salute, this picture is from a Hizb celebration in Lebanon and I think Sparten is right, this is an oath ceremony.
 
As for the BS written above, well, what do you expect from an ideologue who hates something called fact?
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Slayertplsko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Oct-2008 at 18:43
Originally posted by Beylerbeyi Beylerbeyi wrote:


Quote Zieg heil means hail to victory I don't see what the problem is
it's the same with the swastika


Is this serious or are you trolling?


I think his point was that both swastika (especially) and the phrase 'sieg heil' are older than Nazism, so not everyone who uses any of these must necessarily express some kind of Nazistic view. And this is expecially true about swastika, which is several thousand years older than Nazism, so I see no reason to link every use (even modern) of swastika to Nazism.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beylerbeyi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Oct-2008 at 11:38
Quote I think his point was that both swastika (especially) and the phrase 'sieg heil' are older than Nazism, so not everyone who uses any of these must necessarily express some kind of Nazistic view.
 
Who uses swastika and sieg heil in a political context other than nazis? Who uses sieg heil in any kind of context other than parody? It means heil victory in German, so do you think the German troops in Afghanistan today shout sieg heil, because it is older than the nazis? Any German soldier who's caught doing that on camera will be hung from his balls on the nearest lamppost.
 
Quote And this is expecially true about swastika, which is several thousand years older than Nazism, so I see no reason to link every use (even modern) of swastika to Nazism.
 
Buddhist religious use of swastika (nazi one is the mirror image of this btw) aside, just who uses swastika in Europe for anything? It could be figure of decoration, that attracts nobody's attention, but if you use swastika in a political context you will be identified as a nazi today.
 
None of this really requires an explanation, they are obvious. Of course, some nationalist fringe groups may be copying nazi imagery (the nazis copied a lot from german communist imagery), and they may not be nazis themselves, but that does not mean that the imagery itself is nazi or refers to the nazis.
 
Similarly, Adolf used to be a fairly common name before World War 2. It had nothing to do with nazis. Just how many of your friends are called Adolf?
 
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