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Forum LockedPIRA vs. Taliban

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Emperor Barbarossa View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: PIRA vs. Taliban
    Posted: 30-May-2009 at 19:20
I do not know how many people on AllEmpires watch Deadliest Warrior on Spike, but next week's contestants are the Provisional IRA versus the Taliban. The show is quasi-historical, but it can get inaccurate at times and overreaching in its assumptions (it assumes that the average warrior carried a supply-depot worth of weapons)LOL. Personally, I am going with the Taliban because they were effective guerilla warriors (and still can be), whereas it seems the PIRA is better at sneaking around and bombing places than actual guerilla warfare (the PIRA made no real gains in Ireland from the 1960s to the 1990s).

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Parnell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 20:26
The PIRA were great at bombing hotels full of musicians and young people, and great at shooting mothers of 10-13 children for giving a dying British soldier some water after he had been shot by masked gunmen.

They were pretty poor at doing ambushes of military targets; most they ever managed was a couple of potshots at soldiers from far away, occasionally killing a couple.

They were not guerrila warriors in our understanding of the word; they lacked freedom to roam because one sympathetic communities were often adjacent to unsympathetic ones. They had very little popular support, other than a few loudmouths in pubs after several pints.
"Neither apathy nor antipathy can ever bring out the truth of history" Eoin Mac Neill.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 22:04
I completely agree with you, Parnell. The PIRA seems more like a bunch of wussies whose main target was innocent civilians (though the Taliban is also a terrorist organization, they proved that they could fight by kicking the Russians out of Afghanistan). The PIRA, unlike Collin's IRA in the 1920's, never really effectively fought British army units in any real battle. Rather, they were just a nuisance since they bombed hotels and buses. I do not even know why they are having the episode, since it seems pretty clear cut.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote malizai_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 02:34
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I completely agree with you, Parnell. The PIRA seems more like a bunch of wussies whose main target was innocent civilians (though the Taliban is also a terrorist organization, they proved that they could fight by kicking the Russians out of Afghanistan). The PIRA, unlike Collin's IRA in the 1920's, never really effectively fought British army units in any real battle. Rather, they were just a nuisance since they bombed hotels and buses. I do not even know why they are having the episode, since it seems pretty clear cut.
 
Taliban the organization did not exist during the Soviet war. The are a product of the post Soviet era.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 03:12
Sorry, I was thinking of the mujahideen connected with Osama bin Laden (you are correct, there was no Taliban until after the war). But ,anyways, at least the Taliban can wage a guerilla war, unlike the PIRA. They are actually a threat to NATO forces in Afghanistan, and can do more than bus bombings.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote malizai_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 03:49
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

Sorry, I was thinking of the mujahideen connected with Osama bin Laden (you are correct, there was no Taliban until after the war). But ,anyways, at least the Taliban can wage a guerilla war, unlike the PIRA. They are actually a threat to NATO forces in Afghanistan, and can do more than bus bombings.
 
No need to apologize EB, some of those Talibs are indeed sons of the Pashtun mujahideen. Who in the discriptive sense of the word would equally be considered mujahideen. They have only learned to wage guerilla war in response to NATO presence and indeed are a very cunning foe. Their long war strategy is evident as highlighted in Rudyard Kipling's 'Arithmetic on the frontier'.
 
A great and glorious thing it is
To learn, for seven years or so,
The Lord knows what of that and this,
Ere reckoned fit to face the foe--
The flying bullet down the Pass,
That whistles clear: "All flesh is grass."

Three hundred pounds per annum spent
On making brain and body meeter
For all the murderous intent
Comprised in "villainous saltpetre!"
And after--ask the Yusufzaies
What comes of all our 'ologies.

A scrimmage in a Border Station--
A canter down some dark defile--
Two thousand pounds of education
Drops to a ten-rupee jezail--

The Crammer's boast, the Squadron's pride,
Shot like a rabbit in a ride!

No proposition Euclid wrote,
No formulae the text-books know,
Will turn the bullet from your coat,
Or ward the tulwar's downward blow
Strike hard who cares--shoot straight who can--
The odds are on the cheaper man.

One sword-knot stolen from the camp
Will pay for all the school expenses
Of any Kurrum Valley scamp
Who knows no word of moods and tenses,
But, being blessed with perfect sight,
Picks off our messmates left and right.

With home-bred hordes the hillsides teem,
The troop-ships bring us one by one,
At vast expense of time and steam,
To slay Afridis where they run.

The "captives of our bow and spear"
Are cheap--alas! as we are dear.

The PIRA are more comparable to ETA than Taliban as the nature of their campaign is primarily urban.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote es_bih Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 04:47
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I do not know how many people on AllEmpires watch Deadliest Warrior on Spike, but next week's contestants are the Provisional IRA versus the Taliban. The show is quasi-historical, but it can get inaccurate at times and overreaching in its assumptions (it assumes that the average warrior carried a supply-depot worth of weapons)LOL. Personally, I am going with the Taliban because they were effective guerilla warriors (and still can be), whereas it seems the PIRA is better at sneaking around and bombing places than actual guerilla warfare (the PIRA made no real gains in Ireland from the 1960s to the 1990s).


Long time no see.

Can't stand to watch another one of those Spike shows though. Too cheesy.



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Post Options Post Options   Quote es_bih Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 04:50
Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I completely agree with you, Parnell. The PIRA seems more like a bunch of wussies whose main target was innocent civilians (though the Taliban is also a terrorist organization, they proved that they could fight by kicking the Russians out of Afghanistan). The PIRA, unlike Collin's IRA in the 1920's, never really effectively fought British army units in any real battle. Rather, they were just a nuisance since they bombed hotels and buses. I do not even know why they are having the episode, since it seems pretty clear cut.


I think you're confusing Taliban and Al-Queada. The Taliban as we know it, in Afghanistan was a military movement, and a state politic body that was driven out of power, and had terrorists as guests. The Taliban offshoot movement in Pakistan could be considered a terrorist movement, but that would be neither there or here.



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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sparten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 12:44
The PIRA were effectivly an urban insurgency, as opposed to the Talibs who use the mountains. The Talibans worst defeats (and those of their predessessors) have come in urban areas, Jalalabad, Mazar-e-Sharif and now Swat.
 
No comparison.
The Germans also take vacations in Paris; especially during the periods they call "blitzkrieg".
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 13:55
Originally posted by es_bih

Originally posted by Emperor Barbarossa

I do not know how many people on AllEmpires watch Deadliest Warrior on Spike, but next week's contestants are the Provisional IRA versus the Taliban. The show is quasi-historical, but it can get inaccurate at times and overreaching in its assumptions (it assumes that the average warrior carried a supply-depot worth of weapons)LOL. Personally, I am going with the Taliban because they were effective guerilla warriors (and still can be), whereas it seems the PIRA is better at sneaking around and bombing places than actual guerilla warfare (the PIRA made no real gains in Ireland from the 1960s to the 1990s).


Long time no see.

Can't stand to watch another one of those Spike shows though. Too cheesy.



Nice to see you again.
I am not a big Spike fan (first show I have watched on the network, and it is a little corny). I personally am still angry at their one episode in which a Viking is defeated by a Samurai because of the kanabo, a scantly used samurai club. It was more of a mythological weapon than an actual military mainstay. I see your point about the Taliban (I always thought they were the actual government's name and Al-Qaeda was the terrorist movement), but Spike has not made this distinction (so I am guessing they mean Al-Qaeda when saying Taliban).

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Emperor Barbarossa View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Emperor Barbarossa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2009 at 11:51
It was a close one. IRA wins by a little less than 52%. However, this was a five on five battle, and the experts even said that if it was army versus army, the taliban would have won.



IRA Taliban
Overall Kills: 517 483
Close Range: Slingshot: 2 Bayonet: 35
Mid-Range: LPO-50 Flamethrower: 70 RPG-7 Rocket Launcher: 162
Long Range: AR-15 "Armalite": 315 AK-47 Assault Rifle: 245
Special Weapons: Nail Bomb: 130 PMN Mine: 41


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