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Forum LockedMusic: Turkish zeybeks and Greek zeibekiko

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    Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 04:09

Below there are some samples of Turkish zeybek music by Muammer Ketencoglu. They have some similarities with Greek zeibekikos and rembetika.

I'd appreciate if our Greek frends post some zeibekiko samples...

http://dc1.4shared.com/dir/26654/bebbca49



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 04:16

I think "Beyaz geyme toz olur" is special...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 04:26
Also you can post any comments...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yiannis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 05:26

It's very similar to the kind of Rebetika that we call: "Smyrneika" (from Smyrna). They're usually very sad songs full of stories about lost loves, percecution from the police & hasish (not so much in the Smyrneika). Buzuki is the primary instrument, but also piano, violin, quitar and a small buzuki-like instrument called baglamas, are used.

Unfortunatelly I don't listen to that music, so I don't have any songs to post. If you search for Smyrneika in Napster, you'll find many (I hope!).

 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 05:36
As far as I know, there are two ecoles in rebetika Smyrna and Pirea. After the 2nd world war the Pirea ecole became dominant but I like Smyrnea one more. Maybe I'm familiar with that kind of music, that's why...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yiannis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 06:04
true, the Piraeus school (or ecole as you call it  has a much "harder" sound than Smyrneika. Some regards it as a subculture and make connections to the Blues as its counterpart. If I recall there were some Blues musicians did performances with rebetica artists/rebetes (Luisiana Red playing with George Pilali comes to mind)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 06:58
Yiannis, Chios was the island that's very close to Smyrna right? When I was in Cheshme there were Greeks coming with their "takna"s, to the "manav"s and shops of Cheshme.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Menippos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:17
takna's?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:27
boats,  or I think karavi in Greek...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Menippos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:38
Aaa, ok.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:39
I tought tekne was a common word...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Menippos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:40
Nope, it isn't.
Perhaps the greeks of istanbul use it as a loan from turkish to say boat, but it is not common.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yiannis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:54

Originally posted by Menippos Menippos wrote:

takna's?

Takna? I come from Samos island, which is just south of Chios and have never heard of this word. Varka is what we use for small boats and karavi for a ship.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 07:59
Well, I have a Rum friend, he speaks Greek, and calls his boat tekne, even when speaking Greek, so I thought that it was common.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Menippos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 08:09
I see... well, as I said before, he is using the turkish word, even when he speaks greek. Rums do it all the time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Phallanx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 12:41
Actually the difference even though some (me included) may not hear it at first, are quite evident to anyone that has had some music 'schooling'. (so they tell me)
The Hellinic zeimpekikos is a slow 9/8 rythm with a 15 syllable verse broken into 2, one 8 syllable and one 7.  In the 'school' of Pireas the well known troumpa there was a variation of rythms, which is why we find songs from Bambakaris, Tsitsanis etc. played in a 9/18 rythm or the 'fast' 9/8 seen in the  'aptaliko' and the 'kamilieriko'.

While the Turkish 'style' which we also find in some Hellinic zeimpekika like 'se kanourgia barka mphka" = 'I got into a new boat'. Is more of a slow 4/4, something like a slow 'tsifteteli'  I've also heared you dance it in a 'circle' but not sure exactly how accurate that is.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 14:03

When we speak about zeybek-zeibekiko it has a 9/4 or 9/8 rhytym in its nature. Chiftetelli (means double stringed in Turkish) is another rhytmic pattern, though both are used in Turkish folk music and in rebetiko.

The zeybeks I posted are only a few. There are any different kinds of zeybeks. For example the chakici or (tsakitsi in Greek) zeybek is also famous in Greece as ar as I know. For example, in the movie Rembetiko, one old man from Manisa sings it in Turkish.

Of course there are differences between some Turkish zeybeks and Greek zeibekikos. For example, the Piraeus school's zeibekikos are somewhat alien to me (Vamvakaris is a member of it, also tsitsanis, though he is a late one). But the Smyrna school is very similar to Turkish one (some famous members are Andonis Dalgas, Dhimitris Semsis, Roza Eskenazi, Rita Abatzi, etc.). Also sometimes they sing in Turkish.

Also dancing is similar. As you stated before, some zeybeks are played in circles but not touching each other. Also it is played alone. The circle one is a later coreography I think. Also the Greek dancing of zeibekiko is played alone. In its essence it is very similar depending on improvisation. But in the later times professional dancers added some acrobatic figures; but the folk form is not so acrobatic...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Phallanx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 15:46
Why do all posts written in word appear like that?

The movie Rempetimo you mention is actually a real story of Marika Ninou, the composer in the movie Babis, is acually based on the life of Tsitsanis.
I can't really make out what you say about Tsitsanis, but from the 'late' you mention, I'll just say that both he and Bambakaris while there was an age difference (Bambakaris was 10yrs older) published their first album with a 3yr difference. (Bambakaris first) The real difference was in the song 'style' and that Tsitsanis actually revived Bambakaris' career in the 50's.

The Hellinic zeimpekiko is a solo, one dancer and the rest (real tradition says only one,   but...) form a circle around him and clap to the song's rythm.  While the 'aptaliko', is 'antikristo' two dancers face to face dance in similar steps going in a circle both around a specific point and theirselves.

Only lately have women began dancing zeimpekiko, as is it a 'new' custom to find many dancers on the same dancing floor during one song.
There was a time that you could see 'blades shine' for such an offence. (those were the days!!!)

When I said circle in my previous post, I mean I thought you dance it in a circle by holding hands. Probably saw the wrong pic.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kotumeyil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 17:02

Vamvakaris was a classical tekke artist. He told a lot about hashish, evil women, sorrow etc. but Tsitsanis din't say much about tekkes but he told more about African nights, sad love stories, etc. He was a deviation from the classical line.

About dance, I know what you are talking about. I danced zeibekiko with Greeks two weeks ago at Tenedos! In Turkey zeybek is a dance of former bandits called "efe"s or "zeybek"s. It is played in a heroic soul. Sometimes a group of zeybeks played it together turning around a circle without touching each other and it is also played solo like in Greece...

Now I don't have any cds together with e but maybe toorrow I can post some different zeybek links too. In a more traditional style. By the way, why don't you post some Greek zeybekikos? If we can find we can post zeybek-zeibekiko vids, too.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Phallanx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Aug-2005 at 18:12
I liked your idea so here are some songs not all zeimpekika more of a random choice of rempetika in general.

Kazantzidis 'Sunnefiasmenj Kuriaki'  (Cloudy Sunday) (writen by Tsitsanis)

Slow connections (needs Real Audio Player)
http://www.datafox.org/greek/kiriaki.ram

Fast connections:
http://www.datafox.org/greek/sinnefiasmenikiriaki-kazantzidi s.mp3


'Fragkosuriani' lyrics, music M.Bambakaris
(just love a good xasapiko )

Slow connection:
http://www.datafox.org/greek/franko.ram

Fast connection:
http://www.datafox.org/greek/frankosiriani-bithikotsis.mp3
-----------
If you want the lyrics you can find them here:
http://www.datafox.org/greek/gr_remb.html

Markos Vamvakaris:

'Ta Matoklada sou Lampoun' (your elashes shine)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/bambakaris-tama tokladasoulampoun.mp3

Diazugio (divorce)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/bambakaris-diaz igio.mp3

'Oli oi Rempetes tou Ntounia' (all the rempetes in the 'hood')
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/bambakaris-olir embetistoudounia.mp3

S'auton ton kosmo ton kako. (In this bad world)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/bambakaris-saft otonkosmotonkako.mp3

Vassilis Tsitsanis

'Sunnefiasmenj Kuriaki'
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/tsitsanis-sinif iasmenikyriaki.mp3

"Ego plirono ta matia p'agapo" (I pay for the eyes I love)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/tsitsanis-egopl eronostamatia.mp3

Sotiria Bellou

Ase me, Ase me ( leave me leave me)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/bellou-aseme.mp 3

Kane ligaki upomoni (have a bit of patience)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/bellou-kaneliga kiepomoni.mp3

Marika Ninou (mentioned above in the movie Rembetiko)

Agapi pou'gines Dikopo Maxairi (Love that became a two-edged knife)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/ninou-agapipoug ines.mp3

Genithika gia na pono (I was born to be in pain)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/ninou-genithika yanapono.mp3

Yiannis Papayoannou

Kapetan Andrea Zeppo (Captain Andreas Zeppo)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/papayan-zeppo.m p3

Bgike o xaros Pagania (Charon went out to 'hunt')
Damn great zeimpekiko!!!!!!
(the kind I mentioned above, when 'blades shine')
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/papayan-xaros.m p3

Den se thelo pia (I don't want you any more)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/papayianou-dens ethelopia.mp3

Loukas Daralas

To Vouno (the mountain)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/daralas-tobouno .mp3

George Dalaras

HAROKOPOY 1942-1953 by Akis Panou
(one of the BEST songs around)

http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/akipanou-xaroko pou1942-1953.mp3

Na'ne gluko to violi (may the violin be sweet)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/dalarasbagiante ra-nanaiglykatovoli.mp3

Ti sou leei i mana sou (what does your mother tell you)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/dalarasskarveli s-tisouleemanasou.mp3

Apostolis Kaldaras

Mou Spasane ton Mpaglama (They broke my Baglama)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/kalderas-mouspa sanetobaglama.mp3

Ebiba Rembpetes (Cheers Rembetes)
http://www.greecetravel.com/music/musicfiles/kaldaras-ebibar embetis.mp3


Hell it's time open up a Famous Groose, should have after the first song.




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