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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Koreans and Aryans
    Posted: 24-May-2006 at 12:35
Scorpian, you said "Ten years ago i'd an inkling my ancestors were the Alani and now i've pieced together loads of info on them and their movements.  (proven historical facts and not fantasy)"

you should check out www.genographic.com if your interested in tracing your ancestry. They do DNA tests on your origins. From there you may be able to see if your anestors were part Alani.


Edited by Hando - 24-May-2006 at 12:43
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2006 at 12:40
Originally posted by Hando

Originally posted by flyingzone

Just be proud of who you are.


It appears that you are still thinking in a Eurocentric way and that's pathetic. There's no need for the urge to "advise" others on how to feel. Don't worry, I am sure that we already feel that way without having to be prompted. Thanks though.
And if someone shows an interest in that there may be any Alani in Korean history, why do you assume its a wish to be western? That assumption shows that you equate automatically with a desire for caucasianess. Its as if an Italiuanb showed inbterest in the possibility that there is some korean in the italian last name of corea.
Anyway, Alani were not white in the european sense of that word.


Edited by Hando - 24-May-2006 at 12:59
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2006 at 12:57
Originally posted by Hando


 
It appears that you are still thinking in a Eurocentric way and that's pathetic. ... And if someone shows an interest in that there may be any Alani in Korean history, why do you assume its a wish to be western? That assumption shows that you equate automatically with a desire for caucasianess. Its as if an Italiuanb showed inbterest in the possibility that there is some korean in the italian last name of corea.
 
 
Honestly, I really don't quite understand what you are talking about.
 
Looking at today's Korean population's phenotype, it is evident that, if there's any trace of "Aryan-ness", it must be 0.00000001%. So I honestly cannot even begin to comprehend the desire of anyone to trace modern Koreans' "ethnicity" to Alani. From a geoanthropological perspective, the extent of "Malayo-Polynesian" influence on the Korean genotype is probably much more substantial. If one's truly interested in the anthropological origin of the modern Korean population, I think that's a much more interesting trace to follow.  
 
Just not that long ago, we had to kick out a Korean ultranationalist (and all his clones) who believes that ALL ancient peoples living in Northeast and Central Asia were Korean. Even Confucius was Korean. Now, there are some Korean forumers talking about how they may actually be "Aryan" and they seem thrilled by the idea.
 
I just don't understand that. I am the one who actually urged everyone not to generalize the mentality of a few to a whole population.  But I need some reassurance from my Korean friends that the pride of the Korean nation is not founded on some absurd idea of pan-Koreanism or Aryan Koreanism. Koreans have enough real achievements to be proud of - great history, economic miracle, strong tradition of social activism, etc. They definitely don't need to dig out some half-fabricated "facts" and myths to boost their national pride.
 


Edited by flyingzone - 24-May-2006 at 16:18
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-May-2006 at 13:28


you should check out www.genographic.com if your interested in tracing your ancestry. They do DNA tests on your origins. From there you may be able to see if your anestors were part Alani.
[/QUOTE]
 
 
      i already know my ancestors were Alani but thanks for the interesting infoTongue 
       i only had to piece together how the Alani got themselves from way over there to over here to complete my personal puzzle. 
       i'm now delving deeper into the five Alan groupings in Scotland after the Norman Conquest and their impact on Scottish culture. Wink
            
                 
        


Edited by Scorpian - 24-May-2006 at 15:52
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 04:02
Originally posted by flyingzone

Originally posted by Hando


 
It appears that you are still thinking in a Eurocentric way and that's pathetic. ... And if someone shows an interest in that there may be any Alani in Korean history, why do you assume its a wish to be western? That assumption shows that you equate automatically with a desire for caucasianess. Its as if an Italiuanb showed inbterest in the possibility that there is some korean in the italian last name of corea.
 
 
"Honestly, I really don't quite understand what you are talking about.
 
Looking at today's Korean population's phenotype, it is evident that, if there's any trace of "Aryan-ness", it must be 0.00000001%. So I honestly cannot even begin to comprehend the desire of anyone to trace modern Koreans' "ethnicity" to Alani. From a geoanthropological perspective, the extent of "Malayo-Polynesian" influence on the Korean genotype is probably much more substantial. If one's truly interested in the anthropological origin of the modern Korean population, I think that's a much more interesting trace to follow.  
 
Just not that long ago, we had to kick out a Korean ultranationalist (and all his clones) who believes that ALL ancient peoples living in Northeast and Central Asia were Korean. Even Confucius was Korean. Now, there are some Korean forumers talking about how they may actually be "Aryan" and they seem thrilled by the idea.
 
I just don't understand that. I am the one who actually urged everyone not to generalize the mentality of a few to a whole population.  But I need some reassurance from my Korean friends that the pride of the Korean nation is not founded on some absurd idea of pan-Koreanism or Aryan Koreanism. Koreans have enough real achievements to be proud of - great history, economic miracle, strong tradition of social activism, etc. They definitely don't need to dig out some half-fabricated "facts" and myths to boost their national pride."
 


Hi, I was merely stating that you seemed to show in your statement that you assumed Koreans were somehow proud to have Aryan mixture however small that may be. No one was suggesting that there is any need for pride in this. Why would any one feel pride to have any Aryanness. Maybe some one from Europe may think this is wonderfull and I respect there desires, but I was simply stating that such sentiments are not held as a matter of pride in Asia. Whether Korean, Chinese or Japanese etc. In fact, in our respective Asian countries, people have been historically more excited about the prospect of being a homogenous race. So I was wondering why you would think any of us would be proud to have any Aryan ness. Perhaps for you this is a source of pride, and that is great for you, but to us we really don't care. In fact some of us would be rather embarrassed at being so "mixed." (As attested by the general cultural mentalities and historical literature of these respective countries. etc)
Having said that, we all know that Koreans, Japanese and Chinese are not homogenous, but rather have many mixed origins. I was nt suggesting that Koreans are pure either. Anyone who thinks that Central Asians are all Koreans, need to rethink there mentality and education. This is not borne in genetic studies done by such innovators as Cavali Sforza, Spencer Wells and Oppenheimer. In fact Koreans and Japanese have many mixed genetic markers. M21a as opposed to M21b for Chinese, or vice versa. So in effect, Chinese, Korean and Japanese basically share very close ancestry. Nationalism and pure race hog wash dont stand up to the test and such puerile imbecilic ideas have already gotten many deluded people into a lot of trouble. I hope that any deluded individual who thinks they are pure returns to their senses before they cause their "proud pure compatriots" any more trouble. It is dangerous and ridiculous at the same time and not scientifically sound either.
I didnt mean to sound rude, but I thought you seemed to be assuming that Asians were not proud about their heritage and that in your subconcious opinion pride was predicated on Aryan-ness. By suggesting that we should be proud even without Aryan-ness, seemed to suggest your deep hidden sentiments. If I misunderstood you, I apologise.

Thank you for your equivocal reply. I respect that.



Edited by Hando - 25-May-2006 at 04:14
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 04:07
Originally posted by Scorpian



you should check out www.genographic.com if your interested in tracing your ancestry. They do DNA tests on your origins. From there you may be able to see if your anestors were part Alani.
 
 
      i already know my ancestors were Alani but thanks for the interesting infoTongue 
       i only had to piece together how the Alani got themselves from way over there to over here to complete my personal puzzle. 
       i'm now delving deeper into the five Alan groupings in Scotland after the Norman Conquest and their impact on Scottish culture. Wink
            
                 
        
[/QUOTE]

I think thats great you were able to trace it. I know its not the correct thread, but as a history major who loves history from all countries, could you tell us a bit more about what you found in your ancestry?
Also, I read the Alani came to Britain as Legionaires, but I had no idea they came with William the Conqueror in 1066...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 08:38
Originally posted by Hando

 
I didnt mean to sound rude, but I thought you seemed to be assuming that Asians were not proud about their heritage and that in your subconcious opinion pride was predicated on Aryan-ness. By suggesting that we should be proud even without Aryan-ness, seemed to suggest your deep hidden sentiments. If I misunderstood you, I apologise.


 
Yes, you did sound extremely and unjustifiably rude (but I am kind of used to this - a lot of forumers who frequent this East Asian section have this unfortunate fondness for brashness) and yes, you did totally misunderstand me. And honestly I still cannot comprehend why the discussion suddenly turned to discussion about my subconscious?!?? Very puzzling logic even when measured by the standard of psychological babbling ...
 
Apologies (however half-hearted) accepted though. Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 10:14
            
                 
        
[/QUOTE]

I think thats great you were able to trace it. I know its not the correct thread, but as a history major who loves history from all countries, could you tell us a bit more about what you found in your ancestry?
Also, I read the Alani came to Britain as Legionaires, but I had no idea they came with William the Conqueror in 1066...
[/QUOTE]
 
 
    i've posted a few messages in direct relation to the Alani that settled in Brittany under Goar 407AD and those of the earlier 5500 LazyG Sarmations under the Romans at Hadrains Wall.
        Two greatest Brittany Alan victories; against Attila in 451 at Chalons, France and against Harold in 1066 at Hastings. (check my earlier posts for greater details)
       
            
         


Edited by Scorpian - 26-May-2006 at 08:31
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 11:36
 i got a reply from Professor C.Scott Littleton Ph.D. Professor of Anthropology, Emeritus Occidental College Los Angeles CA.
          Seems i got the right guy who wrote about the Alani in Korea in latter fourth century and i'm mighty pleased he saw fit to answer my questions concerning Aryans in Korea.
           Here's his reply.
 
Hi Duncan
    Yes, i'm the guy who suggested that there was an Alanic impact, direct or indirect, on Japan (and Korea and China) in the 4th century C.E. The evidence comes from both archaeology (e.g. the Paekche royal tombs in southwestern Korea, which are almost identical not only to the Japanese
kofun, or "keyhole"-shaped tombs in the Yamato area, but also to the Scytho-Alanic kurgans of Southern Russia and the Ukraine) and mythology. As far as the latter source is concerned, both the Korean Samguk-yusa and the oldest Japanese mythological text, the Kojiki (712C.E.), contain accounts of how three sacred objects descend from the sky and are collected by the youngest son of a primeval being, who become a divine sovereign. These stories are strikingly similar to the Scythian origin myth, as reported by Herodotus, wherein Kolaxais, the youngest son of the primordial being Targitaos, collects a cup, a battleaxe and a yoked plow that fell from the sky and thus becomes the founder of the Royal Scyths.
    Other parallels can be seen between the legends of the ancient Ossetic (Alan) hero Batraz and the Japanese hero Yamato-takera, both of whom die by water after losing their respective magical swords. There is even a Chinese legend dating from the Tang era (8th century C.E.) about a hero who throws his magical sword into the Yangtze, whereupon a hand grabs it and pulls it under the water. And, yes, there are obvious parallels here to the legends about the death of King Arthur, which is one reason why Linda malcor and i have suggested that the core of Arthurian legends, as well as those surrounding the Holy Grail - shades of the Da Vinci Code! - were carried to Western Europe by Sarmations and Alans, beginning in the late 2nd century C.E.
       That at least some Alans may have been among of the horse-riding nomads that invaded Japan ca. 360 C.E. and founded the Imperial Dynasty seems highly probable. Indeed, the Alans seems to have spanned Eurasia from end to end, as Linda A. Malcor and i are convinced that a band of Alans settled in Ireland in the mid 5th century C.E. and were the prototypes of the so-called "Sons of Mil," the last "takers" of Ireland, as recounted in the 12th- century Lebor Gabala Erenn, or "Book of Conquests." The route taken by Mil and his sons, that is, from Scythia across eastern Europe, then on to northern Spain in the company of the Visigoths, and finally by boat to Ireland, correlates almost exactly with the route taken by the Alans in the early 5th century.
      For more information here, please see my articles "Some Possible Arthurian Themes in Japanese Mythology and Folklore" (Journal of Folklore Research 20:67-81, 1983), "Yamato- takeru: An 'Arthurian' Hero in Japanese Tradition" (Asian Folklore Studies 54:259-274,1995), and two works co-authored with Linda Malcor: "Did the Alans reach Ireland? A Reassessment of the 'Sythian' References in the Lebor Gabala Erenn" (in Homage to Jaan Puhvel, Part II, Edgar C Polome and John Grppen eds,pp. 161-182, Washington, DC: The Journal of Indo-European Monograph Series, No 21, 1997) and our book , From Scythia to Camelot: A Radical Reassessment of the Legends of King Arthur, the Knights of the Round Table and the Holy Grail (New York: Garland Publishing. 2nd edition 2000)
       In short you bear an illustrious surname! Hope the foregoing helps. Lots of good wishes and
Cheers,
Scott
 


Edited by Scorpian - 26-May-2006 at 15:29
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 11:45
    C.Scott Littleton has written books and suchlike on this and other subjects in relation to the Sarmations/Alani and can be purchased/ordered from any good book dealers if you want an in depth explanation to his findings.
 
 
 
                 


Edited by Scorpian - 26-May-2006 at 15:32
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 12:17
Originally posted by flyingzone

Originally posted by Hando


 
It appears that you are still thinking in a Eurocentric way and that's pathetic. ... And if someone shows an interest in that there may be any Alani in Korean history, why do you assume its a wish to be western? That assumption shows that you equate automatically with a desire for caucasianess. Its as if an Italiuanb showed inbterest in the possibility that there is some korean in the italian last name of corea.
 
 
Honestly, I really don't quite understand what you are talking about.
 
Looking at today's Korean population's phenotype, it is evident that, if there's any trace of "Aryan-ness", it must be 0.00000001%. So I honestly cannot even begin to comprehend the desire of anyone to trace modern Koreans' "ethnicity" to Alani. From a geoanthropological perspective, the extent of "Malayo-Polynesian" influence on the Korean genotype is probably much more substantial. If one's truly interested in the anthropological origin of the modern Korean population, I think that's a much more interesting trace to follow.  
 
Just not that long ago, we had to kick out a Korean ultranationalist (and all his clones) who believes that ALL ancient peoples living in Northeast and Central Asia were Korean. Even Confucius was Korean. Now, there are some Korean forumers talking about how they may actually be "Aryan" and they seem thrilled by the idea.
 
I just don't understand that. I am the one who actually urged everyone not to generalize the mentality of a few to a whole population.  But I need some reassurance from my Korean friends that the pride of the Korean nation is not founded on some absurd idea of pan-Koreanism or Aryan Koreanism. Koreans have enough real achievements to be proud of - great history, economic miracle, strong tradition of social activism, etc. They definitely don't need to dig out some half-fabricated "facts" and myths to boost their national pride.
 
Flyingzone,
 
I totally agree with you on your post. 
 
I just like to share a non historical event I was involved in.  A co-worker (South-East Asian decent, I don't want to be more specific) was having a conversation with me about how beautiful babies are.  Especially White babies.  Then my conversation migrated to our spouses.  She was divorced three times.  Each time, she married a white man.  One thing lead to another, which compelled me to ask "Why do you only date white guys?"
She stated "To better my race."
 
Not for love or Money.  Gosh even money is a more "noble" cause than to think that your race or culture in inferior to others.
 
I think she is suffering from a inferiority complex.  Then again, she is not alone.  Priceless.
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 15:45

So I went on the Net to try to dig out more information about the claim that "Koreans are Aryan", and voila, I did find some, made by the same Jahanshah Derakhshani person:

"From a linguistic standpoint, Aryan language has influenced the entire world and Korean language contains around 200 Aryan words. You must know that Koreans are totally different from Japanese and Chinese. We may find tall Koreans with blue eyes but we rarely find such cases in Japan or China. Therefore, Aryans have even affected the Korean culture. Ancient Persian terms are also used in West and North Europe -- Finland and Hungary. If we follow up the roots we will find that Aryans had not started to scatter even in the fifth millenium BC."
 
"In the East, loanwords from the Proto-Iranian - again not from Indo-European - are attested in Chinese and Korean, which are to be explained by an early penetration of Proto-Iranian people to China and Korea or even by a prehistoric settlement of the Aryans in Korea."
 
 
In this day and age, anyone could come up with anything (for its "shock value"), so I am not too surprised by someone making such a claim.
 
I am, however, truly delighted by the way that the Korean forumers involved in this discussion respond to this claim. (The discussion is found in another forum whose name I shall not name Wink   ) Basically, none of them believes in this BS. They all share my disdain and disbelief for such an outrageous claim. I feel validated. Smile   I was right about my assertion - we really shouldn't generalize a few persons' belief to that of a whole nation. Korean people have too much commonsense and are too smart to believe in that nonsense.
 
 


Edited by flyingzone - 25-May-2006 at 15:51
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 17:31
        i only followed a thread of information. it is up to the individual wither they believe or disbelieve. (The source was legit and from the horses mouth ) 
          It is for you and others to dispute to your hearts content that which you want to believe.  i can lead you to water but i can't force you to drink.
      i am done here and the rest is up to you as individuals to decide what you believeThumbs Up
              no hard feelings and i'll see you all on other threadsWink
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
                                           
                       
                          


Edited by Scorpian - 26-May-2006 at 15:31
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-May-2006 at 18:20
Originally posted by flyingzone

Originally posted by Hando

 
I didnt mean to sound rude, but I thought you seemed to be assuming that Asians were not proud about their heritage and that in your subconcious opinion pride was predicated on Aryan-ness. By suggesting that we should be proud even without Aryan-ness, seemed to suggest your deep hidden sentiments. If I misunderstood you, I apologise.


 
Yes, you did sound extremely and unjustifiably rude (but I am kind of used to this - a lot of forumers who frequent this East Asian section have this unfortunate fondness for brashness) and yes, you did totally misunderstand me. And honestly I still cannot comprehend why the discussion suddenly turned to discussion about my subconscious?!?? Very puzzling logic even when measured by the standard of psychological babbling ...
 
Apologies (however half-hearted) accepted though. Wink


Hmmm still having kittens are we. I apologised thinking that I would be dealing with a person who would understand what being gracious was, But I suppose that concept has escaped you along with the concept which I was initially talking about. If you don't understand what I was trying to explain to you in my initial post, then it is beyond hope that you can see what I am trying to tell you. Dont worry we don't need you to feel proud about our asian heritage, although you may somehow in your deluded way feel pity for such an ignoble lack in our heritage.LOL
Well I will choose to ignore your passive aggressiveness. I learnt to do that through dealing with young girls at school whom I teach.Wink


Edited by Hando - 26-May-2006 at 02:46
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-May-2006 at 05:03
Originally posted by Hando

Originally posted by flyingzone

Originally posted by Hando

 
I didnt mean to sound rude, but I thought you seemed to be assuming that Asians were not proud about their heritage and that in your subconcious opinion pride was predicated on Aryan-ness. By suggesting that we should be proud even without Aryan-ness, seemed to suggest your deep hidden sentiments. If I misunderstood you, I apologise.


 
Yes, you did sound extremely and unjustifiably rude (but I am kind of used to this - a lot of forumers who frequent this East Asian section have this unfortunate fondness for brashness) and yes, you did totally misunderstand me. And honestly I still cannot comprehend why the discussion suddenly turned to discussion about my subconscious?!?? Very puzzling logic even when measured by the standard of psychological babbling ...
 
Apologies (however half-hearted) accepted though. Wink


Hmmm still having kittens are we. I apologised thinking that I would be dealing with a person who would understand what being gracious was, But I suppose that concept has escaped you along with the concept which I was initially talking about. If you don't understand what I was trying to explain to you in my initial post, then it is beyond hope that you can see what I am trying to tell you. Dont worry we don't need you to feel proud about our asian heritage, although you may somehow in your deluded way feel pity for such an ignoble lack in our heritage.LOL
Well I will choose to ignore your passive aggressiveness. I learnt to do that through dealing with young girls at school whom I teach.Wink
 
You dont speak on behalf of Korean forumers(as Gubook onced openly acknowledged flyingzone's effort in maintain balance here, also the fact the guy was forced to lose his "virginity"), let alone Asian.
 
"Welcome to AE Hando!!!! Looking forward to reading your posts and sharing with us your wisdom."
 
I remember long time ago I (innocently)started a thread entitled "Koreans: the Italians of Asia". It was meant to be a "compliment" to the success of contemporary Korean pop culture and its conquest of the East Asian pop cultural scene. However, a very perceptive and wise Korean forumer correctly pointed out to me that why should Koreans be called "Italians of Asia" and why aren't Italians called "Koreans of Europe." It totally woke me up. This "Eurocentric" mindset is so prevalent in so many of us that sometimes if affects the way we see the world. "
 
You should see Flyingzone has good intention, not the opposite.


Edited by The Charioteer - 26-May-2006 at 05:03
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 03:23
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

http://www.int-pub-iran.com/Interview/interview01.htm

Dr Derakhshani Born in Tehran in 1944, He got his master degree in architecture and urban planning from Germany. He has been involved in historical research and linguistics in Germany for more than 20 years. He got his PhD in history from Yerevan University. His books and articles about ancient Iranian history enjoy international reputation. His latest works about Aryans were published in German some five years ago.

Q: When did Aryans start to scatter?
A: We can respond to this question through the language they spoke. From a linguistic standpoint, Aryan language has influenced the entire world and Korean language contains around 200 Aryan words. You must know that Koreans are totally different from Japanese and Chinese. We may find tall Koreans with blue eyes but we rarely find such cases in Japan or China. Therefore, Aryans have even affected the Korean culture. Ancient Persian terms are also used in West and North Europe -- Finland and Hungary. If we follow up the roots we will find that Aryans had not started to scatter even in the fifth millenium BC.

 
Take a look at this website Cyrus.Some of these guys are "ARYANS".
 
 
 


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 13:16
Aryan Asians, i find that kind of funny.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 16:46
Maybe some of you guys are baffled by how strongly I feel about the idea of "Aryan Asian". I will tell you why here. First of all, the idea of an "Aryan race", whether one likes it or not, has always been associated with racism. While I am pretty sure that the word "Aryan" mentioned in Cyrus's original post refers simply to the ancient culture that preceded the Vedic and Iranian cultures, the term has been corrupted, abused, and exploited too much by people with a racist and ultra-nationalist agenda.
 
In the context of the association between the term "Aryan" and "non-White" people, the racist connotation of "Aryan-ness" has been pushed to a even higher level, as illustrated by the following:
 
(1) During the Second World War, the Nazis gave the Japanese the "Honorary Aryan" status, an idea that has subsequently been exploited by some Japanese ultranationalists to justify their racial superiority over their Asian neighbours.
 
(2) In the mid-1980s, Japan became South Africa's largest trading partner. The racist South Africa regime treated Japanese citizens in the Republic as "honorary whites" under apartheid. The same treatment was also accorded to the Taiwanese immigrants. Back then, Taiwan was one of the few countries that maintained diplomatic ties with the racist Apartheid regime. Ironically, the same "status" was not given to the small Chinese community composed mainly of descendents from migrant workers who had come to work in the gold mines around Johannesburg in the late 19th century.  
 
So the idea of "Aryan Asians" definitely has a very strong racist component to it, and this is what I am responding to. As I have repeated many times in this thread, if any Korean or Japanese person is truly interested in the genetic make-up of his or her nationality, he or she has many other more significant contributors (e.g. the Malayo-Polynesian source) to the gene pool to look into, rather than the so-called "Aryan" contribution which, even if it does exist, may just account for 0.0000001% of their genotype. One could say that, "Oh, I am just intellectually curious." Intellectually curious about what? About the possibility of the 0.0000001% of being "Aryan"? How about the 10% real possibility of being "Malayo-Polynesian" or 50% real possibility of being "Southern Chinese". Why such fascination with "Aryan-ness"?
 
While trying to find out more about the idea of "Aryan Asians" on the Net, naturally I came across many White Supremacist websites. The funny thing is, those scumbags do not give a sh*t about "Aryan Asians". In fact you should read some of the stuff that those bastards say about Asian people, "Aryan" or not. In their eyes, the claim by any Asian people to be "Aryan" is something to be scoffed at. So why should anyone from Korea and Japan care about whether they are "Aryan" or not???
 
My reaction to the idea of "Aryan Asians" primarily stems from my utmost hatred for racism or reverse racism. I hope no one here has a problem with that.
 
 


Edited by flyingzone - 27-May-2006 at 17:58
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The Charioteer View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-May-2006 at 17:39
Originally posted by flyingzone

Maybe some of you guys are baffled by how strongly I feel about the idea of "Aryan Asian". I will tell you why here. First of all, the idea of an "Aryan race", whether one likes it or not, has always been associated with racism. While I am pretty sure that the word "Aryan" mentioned in Cyrus's original post refers simply to the ancient culture that preceded the Vedic and Iranian cultures, the term has been corrupted, abused, and exploited too much by people with a racist and ultra-nationalist agenda.
 
In the context of the association between the term "Aryan" and "non-White" people, the racist connotation of "Aryan-ness" has been pushed to a even higher level, as illustrated by the following:
 
(1) During the Second World War, the Nazis gave the Japanese the "Honorary Aryan" status, an idea that has subsequently been exploited by some Japanese ultranationalists to justify their racial superiority over their Asian neighbours.
 
(2) In the mid-1980s, Japan became South Africa's largest trading partner. The racist South Africa regime treated Japanese citizens in the Republic as "honorary whites" under apartheid. The same treatment was also accorded to the Taiwanese immigrants. Back then, Taiwan was one of the few countries that maintained diplomatic ties with the racist Apartheid regime. Ironically, the same "status" was not given to the small Chinese community composed mainly of descendents from migrant workers who had come to work in the gold mines around Johannesburg in the late 19th century.  
 
So the idea of "Aryan Asians" definitely has a very strong racist component to it, and this is what I am responding to. As I have repeated many times in this thread, if any Korean or Japanese person is truly interested in the genetic make-up of his or her nationality, he or she has many other more significant contributors (e.g. the Malayo-Polynesian source) to the gene pool to look into, rather than the so-called "Aryan" contribution which, even if it does exist, may just account for 0.0000001% of their genotype. One could say that, "Oh, I am just intellectually curious." Intellectually curious about what? About the possibility of the 0.0000001% of being "Aryan"? How about the 10% real possibility of being "Malayo-Polynesian" or 50% real possibility of being "Southern Chinese". Why such fascination with "Aryan-ness"?
 
While trying to find out more about the idea of "Aryan Asians" on the Net, naturally I came across many White Supremacist websites. The funny thing is, those scumbags do not give a sh*t about "Aryan Asians". In fact you should read some of the stuff that those bastards say about Asian people, "Aryan" or not. In their eyes, the claim by any Asian people to be "Aryan" is something to be scoffed at. So why should anyone from Korea and Japan care about whether they are "Aryan" or not???
 
My reaction to the idea of "Aryan Asians" primarily stems from my utmost hatred for racism. I hope no one here has a problem with that.
 
 
 
I read some of those sort too, but not for finding original idea about "Asian Aryan-ness", but for study the psycho of white supremacist.
 
I will give you one regarding this "aryan-ness" in Asian,
they assume its the "white" gave Chinese civilization, as proven by the discovery of Xinjiang Tocharian mummies. Lao zi was a "white" according to some of their arguement.
 
They say, China has been strong nation for more than 2000 thousand years because our sages and rulers had aryan-blood, its that crucial factor helped the Chinese to develop.
Then they say modern Japanese could become a powerful nation in Asia is because they have Aryan-blood. (Ainu)
 
I thought hell, if both of the Chinese and Japanese have this "white-gene" as decisive factor to the success of both, then how they manage to explain, China now lack behind Japan? Is it not conflicting?
 
They argue no, Japan could be sucessful only was because they got help from white powers, and learned from the white.
 
Asians cant innovate on their own but copy white's. etc
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2006 at 11:24
There must be some factors of Caucausoid genes in chinese,korean and japanese people.According to a  research on Y-chromosome by chinese scientists ,5 % chinese men (especially in north china) have some kinds of Y-chromosome similar to european's.
 
I saw a tv program about the origins of Korean ,a woman of a korean museum said that some Scythian travelled to Korea from the Altai mountains .
 
A powerful horse-riding tribe,I don't know what is called in english or korean,may be Mahan,means Horse-Korean in chinese,had ruled other two tribes/countries in many years,probably has some relations with the Scythian ,in my opinion.


Edited by roxsan - 31-May-2006 at 11:39
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