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Forum LockedIt's a waste of time becoming a medieval historian

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    Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 00:22
...... just move to Saudi Arabia and experience the real thing. One wonders how such a primitive country run by such people can be allowed to be such a close by western politicians......
 
Saudi foreign minister, Prince Saud al-Faisal described publicising this an outrage.......
 
 
 

My harrowing story, by

the teenage girl who was

sentenced to 200 lashes

after being gang raped in

 Saudi Arabia

By RICHARD PENDLEBURY - More by this author Last updated at 23:58pm on 30th November 2007

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When a teenage girl was gang raped in Saudi Arabia,a court sentenced HER to 90 lashes. After she complained,it was increased to 200. Now, the victim speaks for the first time...

She was only 19 and a new bride when it happened.

Seven men held her at knifepoint and, for a number of hours, she was subjected to a horrific gang rape.

But when she later went to the authorities, they sentenced her to 90 lashes.

She complained in the media, so the punishment was increased to 200 lashes and imprisonment.

Her lawyer has been suspended for speaking out against it.

Scroll down for more...

Life in the kingdom is still dominated by religious police who enforce a strict Islamic lifestyle (Posed by model)

Too outlandish to be true? Well, these are the bare facts of the so- called "Qatif girl" case, which has become a cause celebre among Western liberals and in Saudi Arabia, the West's most important Middle Eastern ally.

Earlier this week, the Saudi foreign minister, Prince Saud al-Faisal, declared that what had happened was, indeed, an "outrage".

But he did not mean that the rape victim had suffered a gross injustice.

No, only that criticism of his country was a foreign conspiracy.

The plight of the anonymous victim has served to cast an embarrassing light on one of the world's most authoritarian and oppressive regimes.

Specifically, it has exposed the power of a judicial system based on the Sharia law of the extreme Wahhabi sect of Sunni Islam and its appalling treatment of women and persecution of religious minorities.

International pressure to clear the young woman is growing.

Now, as one Saudi judge who might well hear her latest appeal declares that she should have been sentenced to death, the victim's voice has been heard in public for the first time.

The pressure group Human Rights Watch has just released a transcript of an interview which the Qatif girl gave to one of its workers.

Her account reveals the horrific details of the original ordeal and how, having gone to the police, she was abused and demonised by the Saudi judicial system.

The attack took place in February last year and had its roots in a typical Saudi teenage arrangement which in the West would seem odd, but is a way of getting round the strict Islamic sex segregation laws.

Forbidden from approaching young women directly, young men make contact by publicly displaying their own mobile phone numbers on cards as they pass in the street or by dropping the cards through open car windows.

Others make contact using their phone's Bluetooth technology, which allows users to send messages to nearby mobile phones without knowing the telephone number.

"I had a relationship with someone on the phone," recalled the Qatif girl.

"It started when we were both 16. I had never seen him before, I just knew his voice. Then he started to threaten me and I got afraid.

"He threatened to tell my family about the relationship. Because of the threats and fear, I agreed to give him a photo of myself."

But when the girl wed another young man she became worried about the photo she had given to her "ex-boyfriend".

"I asked him for the photo back but he refused. He said: 'I'll give you the photo on the condition that you come out with me in my car.'

"I told him we could meet at a souk [market] near my neighbourhood in Qatif."

She recalled: "He started to drive me home, and when were about to turn the corner to my house, another car stopped right in front of our car.

"Two people got out of their car and stood on either side of our car. The man on my side had a knife.

"They tried to open our door. I told the individual with me not to open the door, but he did. He let them come in. I screamed."

The ordeal had begun.

"One of the men brought a knife to my throat. They told me not to speak. They pushed both of us to the back of the car and started driving. We drove a lot, but I didn't see anything since my head was forced down.

"They took us to an area with lots of palm trees. No one was there. If you kill someone there, no one would know about it."

First, they took the girl's male companion from the car.

He was the victim of homosexual rape a number of times during the course of the evening.

"I was so afraid," the girl said.

"Then they forced me out of the car. They pushed me really hard. I yelled out: 'Where are you taking me? I'm like your sister.'"

They took her to a building. Then two men came in and stripped her.

"The first man with the knife raped me. I was destroyed. I tried to force them off but I couldn't. Another man came in and did the same thing to me. I didn't even feel anything after that."

For two hours the girl begged the two men to take her home.

"I told them that it was late and that my family would be asking about me.

Then I saw a third man come into the room. There was a lot of violence.

After the third man came in, a fourth came. He slapped me and tried to choke me.

"The fifth and sixth ones were the most abusive. The fifth one took a photo of me like this. After the seventh one, I couldn't feel my body any more. I didn't know what to do. When a very fat man was on top of me I could no longer breathe."

Before she was eventually taken home by the gang, she was raped again by all seven attackers.

"They took my mobile and saw my husband's picture in my wallet.

"When I got out of the car [at her home], I couldn't even walk. I rang the doorbell and my mother opened the door. She said: 'You look tired.'

"She thought I was with my husband.

"I went to the hospital the next day. I didn't eat for one week after that, just drank water. I didn't tell anyone, but I would see the rapists faces in my sleep."

However, the story began to leak out.

"The criminals started talking about it in my neighbourhood. They thought my husband would divorce me. They wanted to ruin my reputation. Slowly, my husband started to know what had happened."

But he stood by her, outraged at what the men had done and the fact they were going unpunished.

"Two of the criminals were walking round our neighbourhood, right in front of me," her husband said.

He complained to the police on four occasions before anything was done.

Human rights activists are sure the authorities' reluctance to investigate and their subsequent actions have much to do with the fact that the woman was from Saudi's Shi'ite minority, while the accused are from the majority Sunni Muslims.

When her attackers were finally called to account, the girl had to go to court, where she received a hostile reception.

"At the first session, the judges said to me: 'What kind of relationship did you have with this individual [the man she originally agreed to meet]? Why did you leave the house? Do you know these men?'

"They asked me to describe the situation. They yelled at me. They were insulting. The judge refused to allow my husband in the room with me.

"One judge told me I was a liar because I didn't remember the dates well. They kept saying: 'Why did you leave the house? Why didn't you tell your husband where you were going?'"

The second session, in October last year, proved to be even more shocking.

Four of the attackers - the three others were not found - were given sentences of between one and five years and between 80 and 1,000 lashes.

They were convicted only of kidnapping because the prosecution could not prove rape even though the video images taken on the mobile phone during the attack were presented to the judges.

"I thought these people shouldn't even live," said their victim.

"I thought they would get a minimum of 20 years."

Then the senior judge turned to her and her male companion on the night of the gang rape.

"He said: 'You get 90 lashes. You should thank God you're not in prison.'

"I asked him why and he said: "You know why. Because mingling begets evil.' "

She had been convicted under the khalwa - Sharia law which forbids any woman from being alone in the company of a male to whom she is not related.

"Don't you have any dignity?" her husband demanded of the judges. It was no good. And worse was to follow. The girl grew suicidal. Her own brother blamed her for the attack and his family's "shame".

"He hit me and tried to kill me," she said.

But she was not prepared to accept her unjust punishment.

With the backing of the leading Saudi human rights lawyer, Abdul Rahman al-Laham, she made the facts public, even giving an interview to an Arab TV channel. But far from embarrassing the authorities, this merely seemed to enrage them.

On November 14, the General Court of Qatif struck back, increasing her sentence to 200 lashes and six months in prison.

(Flogging is usually carried out in batches by a prison official who has to hold a copy of the Koran under his whip arm, which prevents it from being raised very high).

The rapists' sentences were also increased to between two and 11 years each.

An official at the court said that her sentence was raised because of "her attempt to aggravate and influence the judiciary through the media".

Judge Sa'd al-Muhanna also banned her lawyer, Abdul Rahman al-Laham, from the courtroom and from representing her in future for allegedly raising his voice in court.

His licence to practise has been suspended and his passport seized.

He faces a further hearing before a Ministry of Justice disciplinary committee in Riyadh next week for appearing regularly on television and talking about the case.

Overnight, though, the Qatif girl's case became a matter of international interest.

How on earth could the Saudi authorities justify such behaviour?

US presidential hopeful Hillary Clinton became involved. But far from retreating, the Saudi authorities dug their heels in.

Official statements posted on the Ministry of Justice website in the past fortnight have alleged that the girl admitted adultery and was already undressed in the car when she was attacked by the rapists.

One statement went so far as to say that it was her own fault: "The main reason the crime took place was because the woman and her companion, who exposed her to this heinous crime, did not follow the law."

The ministry chastised the media for providing an "unjustified defence" of the woman.

A representative of the ministry also appeared on television blaming her for the attack.

He strongly hinted that she had engaged in adultery.

Earlier this week a Saudi newspaper published an interview with Judge Dr Ibrahim bin Salih al-Khudairi of the Riyadh Appeals Court, in which he said that he would have sentenced her to death.

The Appeals Court, and possibly Judge al-Khudairi, will consider the appeal that the Qatif girl said she intends to file.

Impartial? Hardly.

"How is this woman going to get a fair hearing?" asks Farida Deif, of Human Rights Watch.

"The Ministry of Justice has been highly defamatory of her and suggestive that she committed adultery and it was, therefore, her own fault.

"Yes, she broke the law on mingling, but the court should have shown some discretion given that she was brutally gang-raped.

"But this is a country with no written penal law, in which the judges are religious scholars with very little formal legal training."

Thanks to the internet and satellite television however, the Qatif girl's case has caused many Saudis to question the fairness of their own judicial system.

Legal reforms have been announced recently.

But life in the kingdom is still dominated by the religious police who work for the Commission For The Propagation Of Virtue And The Prevention Of Vice to enforce a strict Islamic lifestyle.

They are the untouchables.

Indeed, only on Thursday it was reported that charges against two religious policemen had been dropped. They had been investigated following the death of a man in custody.

The man had been arrested for allegedly drinking alcohol and there was evidence that he had been kicked in the head - but not sufficient to pursue the case, a judge decided.

It echoes a similar case in the summer in which three other members of the religious police had charges dropped after the death of another suspect in custody.

The victim's alleged crime was, like that of the Qatif girl, being alone with an unrelated member of the opposite sex.

The Saudi foreign minister has said that the judicial system will review the Qatif girl's case.

In the meantime, as she awaits her fate, she remains under virtual house arrest, unable to communicate with the outside world; her traumatised family's phones are tapped by the religious police and they are followed when they leave the house.

Meanwhile, the girl is still tormented by thoughts of suicide. But then, in the medieval world of Saudi law she has only herself to blame.

 
 


Edited by Paul - 01-Dec-2007 at 12:32
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 00:34
The only thing she should be charged of in her country is 'mingly'. From what I now that means not being escorted by a relative. Instead she was in the car with the deviant ex' boyfriend of her past.
 
Personally. That is terrible justice. Terrible Islam. Unfortuantely, Saudi Arabia has conerned the market on Wahhabi conservatism and has been trying to spread it's form of Islam for decades. It's a rich country with fingers all over the world.
 
No diisrespect to our Saudi's on this forum. Maybe you all could shine some light on this terrible incident.


Edited by Seko - 01-Dec-2007 at 00:35
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The solution to Saudi Arabia's  abusses on women? Forget oil, go hydrogen....
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 06:51
Hello guys
 
I have a quiz in an hour's time but when I read this thread, the hell with the quizz.
 
First of all, please, do not philosophize about a case that you know absolutely nothing about it. You were not present during the original trial nor during the actual appeal. I will elaborate later but the women (who is married by the way) was a well known HOOKER, a prostitute, a sl*t. She used to go on double dates, play on many strings and in the end she was raped. The case is quite complicated but to make thing short, the punishment mentioned above is actually rather merciful, she committed, based on testimony and her own confession Grand Adultry the punishment of which is stoning in both Shia and Sunni jurispudence. I will explain the full detailes of the case later.
 
Al-Jassas


Edited by Al Jassas - 01-Dec-2007 at 06:55
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Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

Hello guys
 
I have a quiz in an hour's time but when I read this thread, the hell with the quizz.
 
First of all, please, do not philosophize about a case that you know absolutely nothing about it. You were not present during the original trial nor during the actual appeal. I will elaborate later but the women (who is married by the way) was a well known HOOKER, a prostitute, a sl*t. She used to go on double dates, play on many strings and in the end she was raped. The case is quite complicated but to make thing short, the punishment mentioned above is actually rather merciful, she committed, based on testimony and her own confession Grand Adultry the punishment of which is stoning in both Shia and Sunni jurispudence. I will explain the full detailes of the case later.
 
Al-Jassas
 
Please, Lord say, i didn't read this.
 
She is or was a hooker, so it was her own fault to be raped?
 
The punishment was mercyful? Please let me never know, what a not mercy punishment means.
 
Might be, Lord , i'm only an ignorant, western mollycoddle who belives in such stupid things like democracy, justice and respect. But Lord, please prevent that i sometimes will know the true promise of the mercy adjudgement of a saudi arabian court.


Edited by ulrich von hutten - 01-Dec-2007 at 11:51

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Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

Hello guys
 
I have a quiz in an hour's time but when I read this thread, the hell with the quizz.
 
First of all, please, do not philosophize about a case that you know absolutely nothing about it. You were not present during the original trial nor during the actual appeal. I will elaborate later but the women (who is married by the way) was a well known HOOKER, a prostitute, a sl*t. She used to go on double dates, play on many strings and in the end she was raped. The case is quite complicated but to make thing short, the punishment mentioned above is actually rather merciful, she committed, based on testimony and her own confession Grand Adultry the punishment of which is stoning in both Shia and Sunni jurispudence. I will explain the full detailes of the case later.
 
Al-Jassas


I'm with Ulrich on this one... are you serious, al Jassas? By the way, how many "well-known hookers" are there in that part of the world? In ultra-conservative Wahabbi Saudi Arabia, prostitutes are house-hold names, celebrities even? Just because a woman has more than one male partner does not make her a street-walker... Heaven forbid! Double dates? Sounds like the collapse of civilization to me... Ditch this archaic BS and join the 21st century, pal.

PS- Were you there at the "original trial" or the "actual appeal?" Are you some sort of Saudi judiciary? Because if not, then it seems you would probably no "nothing about" the actual trial as well.

This is the equivalent of letting some fellows off for rape in America because "the girl was dressed like a slut and looked like she wanted to be raped;" nevermind the fact that she screamed "No" repeatedly, and had to be forced into the sex at knifepoint... f*cking ridiculous. If you do not feel outrage at this act, then the subtler nuances of things like "human rights" and "civilization" seem to have fallen on deaf ears.


Edited by Brian J Checco - 01-Dec-2007 at 07:44
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Hello to you all

 
Well brian, believe it or not, there are more hookers than you can imagine in Saudi Arabia. I know that because several of my relatives work for the Committee for the promotion of virtue and prevention of vice. In 2005 a nationwide attack on slums netted more than 10 000 of these hookers, some Saudi but most foriegners, some male but most are female. I know the slums they are in and these were off limits for the police. After several incidents including 11 member of the Airforce acadamy catching HIV from one of these hookers (she stayed in their apartment for a weekend of debauchery), an exponential rise in HIV incidents in the city of Jeddah, the murder of two policemen on duty and the public rape attempt on an egyptian girl in front of the police in broad daylight (fortunately she was defended by those present), police attacked them and netted a lot of people but I know several friends here in the uni who visit these hookers during most weekends. They go to Bahrain to buy condoms and return here or stay there to find prostitutes.
 
I don't have much time now to explain the situation here but she is not the only one to suffer what some here see as injustice. A black belted kid in Taekwondo sent two burglars who broke into his house to the hospital with broken bones, he was punished for using excessive force and was sent to prison spending more time than the buglars.
 
 
The woman was not a "sex worker", she came from a prominent Shia family but she was indeed a slut. Now, how do I know the detailes, I lives in the same area (25 km south of Qatif) I knew about the case from about day one and the judge leaked the sentence and the appeal was published. I will give you all the detailes later.
 
 
Al-Jassas


Edited by Al Jassas - 01-Dec-2007 at 09:57
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I'm waiting with baited breath and expected to hear this... Hell, I'll even get a bag of popcorn and a sixer of beer. I recommend any other readers get ready for the show...
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when the oil runs out they will be both poor and backwards, if the saudi people do not have the balls to refuse to live under such diabolical laws,then so be it, like i often quote: if you tolerate this, then your children will be next.
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The human race at its most revolting; God must look on us and weep.

Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

The woman was not a "sex worker", she came from a prominent Shia family but she was indeed a slut.


First; selling sex is not harmful, at worst it is harmful to the prostitute, and thus it cannot on a moral level elicit rape or murder against him/her.

Second; the derogatory term "slut" is based on the assumption that having many sex partners is morally inferior, even if this harms no one else than the people who choose to become involved in it. Since the term is almost always applied to women it's also misogynistic and an instrument in keeping women oppressed by making them ashamed of their sexual urges.

In my opinion, and I suppose in almost everyone else's on this forum, whether a woman (or a man for that matter) has many sex partners and sells sex is judicially irrelevant; neither behaviour is socially harmful and thus does not justify any violent repercussions, especially not rape under threat of murder, which certainly is socially harmful.

The Saudi outlook is probably another one though; they have their concepts of family honour and religious virtue. I know there are modernising reforms in Saudia going on these days, but it doesn't happen overnight, and as long as these attitudes linger we will continue to see cases like this, and people who actually defend them.

Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

I know the slums they are in and these were off limits for the police. After several incidents including 11 member of the Airforce acadamy catching HIV from one of these hookers (she stayed in their apartment for a weekend of debauchery), an exponential rise in HIV incidents in the city of Jeddah, the murder of two policemen on duty and the public rape attempt on an egyptian girl in front of the police in broad daylight (fortunately she was defended by those present), police attacked them and netted a lot of people but I know several friends here in the uni who visit these hookers during most weekends. They go to Bahrain to buy condoms and return here or stay there to find prostitutes.


Now here are actual problems, but they can't be used to justify rape, murder or whippings. Many would agree there is no offense that can justify these acts at all.

It is of little surprise that you have trouble with HIV, if people have to go all the way to Bahrain to buy condoms. Lack of condoms is also one of the major causes behind the spread of HIV in Africa. Sex is a fundamental need in the human race, and you can't prevent people from having sex with this silly medieval-esque Committe for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vice. The same goes for prostitution; you may ban it but the activity will still continue underground, especially in a country like Saudi Arabia where you are officially prohibited from having sex before marriage. Prostitution is banned in my country too from 2009. I don't agree with this legislation but prostitutes are less sought after here since the people are sexually liberated. In a way Saudi Arabia creates its own problems; the men are pressured into making use of prostitutes to satisfy their sexual urges, as they can't simply have sex with the girl from the family next door without insulting that family's honour. Some might say that in an ideal world one will wait until marriage with sex, but this isn't an ideal world, and unless we govern it according to realities we will only create misery for ourselves, like in Saudi Arabia.

If some of the prostitutes are criminals, as in committing acts that are actually socially harmful, then punish those acts (although preferably with civilised methods), and not the prostitution itself.

Edited by Reginmund - 01-Dec-2007 at 13:33
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Their house, their rules. Simple. I find the law to be, how do you put this delicatly; inane, but that is still their country and not yours or mine.

The Germans also take vacations in Paris; especially during the periods they call "blitzkrieg".
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Originally posted by Sparten Sparten wrote:

Their house, their rules. Simple. I find the law to be, how do you put this delicatly; inane, but that is still their country and not yours or mine.



I find this attitude just a bit too laid back to be comfortable with. I'd rather say it is the duty of any civilised and enlightened man, like yourself, to share your progressive ideas and motivate the rest of the world to step out of the medieval mire.
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Originally posted by Sparten Sparten wrote:

Their house, their rules. Simple. I find the law to be, how do you put this delicatly; inane, but that is still their country and not yours or mine.

 
If the mankind had followed those principles, all the struggles for a self-determinated life, for fair earnings, peace and freedom hadn't took place.
Poor world, that!

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The right to be let alone is also a fundamental principle as is that of soverignity of states. Saudi Arab is a soverign state and thus can determine its own procedural and substantive caselaw.

The issue here for me is not the appropriateness of the actions (its inane as I mentioned above), but rather the right of nations to manage their own affairs.
 
Incidentally as Al Jassas's comments illustrate, that there are people whose views of "civilised" behavious differs from your own, and one of the hallmarks of civilised behaviour is recognising that fact.
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Originally posted by Sparten Sparten wrote:

Their house, their rules. Simple. I find the law to be, how do you put this delicatly; inane, but that is still their country and not yours or mine.

 
 
I believe the Afrikana resistance Movement had the same views about Apartied.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mixcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 14:08
Originally posted by Sparten Sparten wrote:

Their house, their rules.


So if I'd like to murder someone that's ok as long as it's in my own house?
"Some argue that atheism partly stems from a failure to fairly and judiciously consider the facts"
"Atheists deny the existence of Satan, while simultaneously doing his work."

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Al Jassas View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 14:12
Hello to you all
 
 
The story began a long time ago, this woman was a slut. She had multiple affaires with grown men (sometimes under the guise of Muta marriage) since she was 15 years old. She came from a prominent family and by the time she was 16, she became involved with the man she went out with on that faitful night. That man's family was not so big. By the time she was 18, she already started another relationship with another man from another big family in her region, that last man became her husband.
 
After he learned that he was tricked, the lover began to plot for revenge. He threatened her with exposure which would have been very damaging for her family and started blackmailing her. Now, since one of my relatives is a high ranking officer, he told us that the normal thing was that she should have called the police who take all blackmail cases seriously. One guy I know tried to blackmail a restaurant (a lousy one too) and he was swiftly caught and the restaurant, despite having a very poor record was off the hook. But she didn't, and instead, she offered (by her own testimony) "one-on-one" negotiations. She went with him in his car to an isolated farming area in the dead of night (about 8:30 while the sun sets about 5:00) and from here, every party says something.
 
The woman said that the guy tried to take advantage of her, a group of men who were in league with him came and took them both after they recognized both her and her lover, they already knew about they old relationship but they also knew that she was married and they raped both of them.
 
The lover said he defended her but they were too many and she was raped and he was raped and they were to be blackmailed.
 
The rapists, each of them had a completely different acount from the other, said the woman offered her self to them if they rape and tape the lover.
 
In any given case police on patrol caught the woman and her lover and here, the case went out of her hands. The family of the duped husband pressed for a civil law suit against the woman for adultry, the duped husband refused but had to accept of the digrace was put on the internet.
 
The rapists were on the run for nearly a month until they gave themselves up.
 
 
During the investigation and subsequent trials, the woman changed her testimony 3 times. The rapists and the lover all had their conflicting part during the testimony. All these changes happened while they were under oath. In at least one of the testimonies, the woman said that she did offer herself to the rapists but this time to save her life and the life of her lover and that she stripped nude to do that.
 
Now, you might ask, if the rape was taped and the punishment for it is death, then why was these people weren't sentenced to death. Well the answer is two fold.
 
First, no kind of evidence is admitted in any kind of trial as a proof of guilt. ie, if you were taped killing a person, only your own admission or the testimony of 2 people is sufficient to send you to die.
 
Second, there is a juidicial principle similar to double jeopardy in Saudi Arabia. This principal is a capital punishment is commuted when an evidence exists that cast a doubt about the validity of the punishment. For example, if you defended your self against an armed intrusure, you will be free to go but if the intrusure was not armed and you killed him, then you face capital punishment. Here, The raped woman herself had so many conflicting testimonies and so shadowy a past that punishing these people with death was unfair.
 
However, she was punished for betraying the trust of her husband (which is a crime here) and involving in illicit actions by her own admission and thus she was punished. The last matter was a civil suit (brought by the husband's family) not a criminal one.
 
I hope you learned something and excuse me for the lack of legal knowledge but this is what happened.
 
Al-Jassas 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote longshanks31 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 14:15
their home their rules? ok come back hitler all is forgiven, i used to work with two somalian refugees, who had, had real tough times back home, they were muslim, and even they looked down on the laws of saudi arabia.
Life is very short, the state infliction of misery is an abomination, still could be worse,
could be here.
long live the king of bhutan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 14:41

Al Jassas you mentioned that she was punished by becoming involved with illicit actions and for breaking her husbands trust. Yet she was supposedly only going to visit her old boyfriend (according to the article posted here) in order to get her old foto back which he had while they had been an item. She felt blackmailed. The old boyfriend was a stalker and had intentiones contrary to her safety. Afterwards they were both raped by others.

Now, slut or not, where is the justice? She should have only been charged for unescorted traveling at night and maybe the breaking a marital vow, adultry (according to your country's laws). Afterall she was raped. To doubt that after all the behaviour of the gang evidently leads to believe it was rape would be missing the point and it would place heavier burden on the victim (the slut, wife, women or whatever they tend to call her).
 
Don't you find it unjustifiable that the initial focus of the trial was about the womens honesty? How obviious does it have to be. Stalkers, gang, intimidation, hiding from the law. All fingers point to the gangs guilt. Yet the focus of the trial appeared to make it out that the women was to blame. That is the part of your justice system that most of us have a hard time with. She could have been visited by health care professionals to help her through that rather traumatic ordeal. She should not have her husband thrwon out of court or her lawyer denied access. She should of been defended by the courts themselves over the charge of rape. Not harrassed by the court.
Copyright 2004 Seko
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2007 at 14:41

Al Jassas, was the girl a 'slut', or an actual prostitute??

Which piece of information is true?
 
 
Am not I Dametas? Why, am not I Dametas?
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