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Forum LockedIslam and Christianity (Muslim perspective)

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Poll Question: Is America a Christain nation?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
24 [53.33%]
21 [46.67%]
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    Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 18:19
America has a lot of Christians but I tend to see it as a secular nation, which is good in my opinion!!
Christianity has played a major part of our history!!
I would not want to see any religion get too much power but people have the right to express their religious views no matter what they are!!



I will not vote in this because I am not a Muslim!! But, anyone can post their view!!

Edited by eaglecap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 18:46

America was founded on sound principles that reflect a degree of moral guidance. Our forefathers were aware of problems with monarchies and sought to establish rights for all. Now isn't that how islam started and is practiced? Rights for all is a hallmark of freedom from tyranny.

Chritianity was and is the majority religion in the United States. The constitution is a guaranture of religious rights. Now a-days there is much publicity from christian evangalists and christian conservative fundamentalists to skew laws into their favor. They ridicule other religions. No tolerance. We need to appreciate our rights that our forefathers so willingly endured for themselves and for future generations.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 18:55

the majority of our founders were not conventional christians, they were deists and you can find various quotes

"As to Jesus, I have some doubts as to his divinity" -Benjamin Franklin

"CHristianity is the cruelist system ever forced on man"- Thomas Jefferson

not conventional, but by modern standars most were christian enough, or pseudo christian

"the people are nothing but a great beast...
I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
-Alexander Hamilton
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eaglecap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 19:11
thanks for voting Seko!!
America was founded on sound principles that reflect a degree of moral guidance. Our forefathers were aware of problems with monarchies and sought to establish rights for all. Now isn't that how islam started and is practiced? Rights for all is a hallmark of freedom from tyranny.

This I can agree with!!!

The second half I do not but why should I defend a religion I do not believe in but maybe there are some Christians or Mormons who can answer this!!

One thing though, can you explain the intolerance towards Christians and Animist in Sudan?? (2 million have died in that war and many have been enslaved by intolerant Muslims) I am glad that 85-90% of Muslims in the world do not go to that extreme.

Why aren't the peaceful Muslims in America speaking out against the radical few??

How do you define intolerance in America from Christian sects?

Do you think it is a hate crime for a Christian church to hold seminars about other religious groups like the Muslims, Mormons or JW's?
I know that some Pastors in Australia were charged with hate crimes for having seminars about Islam and simply teaching what the Haddith and Koran say!
I would support and defend the right for Muslims to preach and hold their own seminars in support of their faith, free speech and freedom of religion.

I do not know how far your roots go back in america, but I have roots back to the American Revolution so it is also part of my ancestry. I also have recent immigrants in my family tree- my mother's parents came from Europe!
peace be upon you!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 19:24
the ideal Christian in America is one like my one grandmother, she is a minister and has long been in charge of her church yet she is well read in all religions and all histories and has worked in Rwanda and other countries.  She knows all religions very well and gives them all due credit and thus think s that in a multicultural country like the US no religion should be expressly supported or denied.  That is the right way to go, unfortunately most Christians are nowhere near as cool or educated as my grandmother so for saftey reasons the government should be more secular.
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I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eaglecap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2005 at 21:29
Originally posted by Tobodai Tobodai wrote:

the ideal Christian in America is one like my one grandmother, she is a minister and has long been in charge of her church yet she is well read in all religions and all histories and has worked in Rwanda and other countries. She knows all religions very well and gives them all due credit and thus think s that in a multicultural country like the US no religion should be expressly supported or denied. That is the right way to go, unfortunately most Christians are nowhere near as cool or educated as my grandmother so for saftey reasons the government should be more secular.


That is Kwelllll!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 10:30

No. America is a Jewish nation...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OSMANLI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 12:35

America is not a jewish nation although they do have a considerable influence on US government. For example Freemasons, zionists, major companies such coccacola or McD being Jewish. Don get me wrong i am not anti-semetic although the jews in power ARE anti-Islam


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 14:43
I agree with you, but i think the issue is deeper. Not only with some special companies or these societies. The Jews are in much more control over USA. I think the USA is only a strong, symbolic puppet of these societies... Democrasy and freedom are their masks, humanism and anti terrorism are their weapons...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Mar-2005 at 21:39
hmm I see we have some people who have the same views as neo nazis..wonderfull
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Uthman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 04:21
i believe that America is a Christian nation run by Jews.
LONG LIVE THE BIELIVERS
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Landsknecht_Doppelsoldner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 07:09
Originally posted by OSMANLI OSMANLI wrote:

America is not a jewish nation although they do have a considerable influence on US government. For example Freemasons, zionists, major companies such coccacola or McD being Jewish. Don get me wrong i am not anti-semetic although the jews in power ARE anti-Islam

The Freemasons are not "Jewish", though there are Jews who are members.

Freemasonry is open to any man who has a belief in God, regardless of what specific religion he's from.

Most of the founding fathers of the USA were Masons.

If anything, most of the members (in the USA, at least) are probably Protestant Christians (Freemasonry has a longstanding rivalry with Catholicism, and, while there may be Catholics who are members, they are officially forbidden by their catechism to become Masons).

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I'll hit on the head that it resounds in his heart."


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Le Renard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 12:09
I think that America is a Christain nation.  But it is run by Atheists becasue they don't want any religion to influence their lives.  The majority of America is Christian
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 12:20
Mcdonalds isn't 'Jewish', just look at the menu.

As for coke, http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/israel.asp


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 19:03
Originally posted by Tobodai Tobodai wrote:

hmm I see we have some people who have the same views as neo nazis..wonderfull


I love how some people use the label "nazi" or "extremist" to defend ridiculous state policies...

Anyway, America is run by Evangelicals who think there has to be a war, and Jerusalem in Jewish hands for the Armageddon to come, then their lord Jesus would return to establish his kingdom. They're trying to make Jesus come back "faster" one might say, and their philosophy goes hand in hand with Zionism (actually the Evangelicals are funding Zionism more than Jewish people are).

I would be very careful to differentiate Jews and Zionists, being a Jew does not necessarily make you a Zionist.

As for the poll, I said no. America is simply a country run by Christians and Jews at the moment. In the long future it could be anyone else, it all depends on who's on top economically.





Edited by Turk
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Emile Boutros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 20:39
The Zionist "Christians" are a misguided bunch. I have been shouted at by many of them for being Christian and not agreeing with the rape/theft of Palestine by the European Zionists while at uni in the US. They WANT nuclear war w/ Russia because Russia was supposed represent the antichrist and such things. I heard of a US offcial that prayed for nuclear war everyday because of his "religious" beliefs about Armageddon. I have hear that the belligerent policies of Ronald Regan were to provoke nuclear war (thank God he was not successful with this!). I do not trust American Protestant Christians with government because they seem very hositle. I do not consider such posturing to be Christian. Also US signed treaty with Algiers that said the US was in no way a Christian nation way back when (to end one of the Barbary Wars) so I do not think  that it is a Christian country. THough I am not Muslim. Also most AMericans practice a "Christianity" that I think of as heritical (Evangelical, Mormon, "carizmatic" etc where you supposedly have to roll on the ground and foam at the mouth having back spazims to be intouch with God). There are not many Orthodox as I had thought there would be. I was told there were whole cities of them and such, when I got here it was very different from descriptions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 21:16

Originally posted by Turk Turk wrote:

Originally posted by Tobodai Tobodai wrote:

hmm I see we have some people who have the same views as neo nazis..wonderfull


I love how some people use the label "nazi" or "extremist" to defend ridiculous state policies...

Anyway, America is run by Evangelicals who think there has to be a war, and Jerusalem in Jewish hands for the Armageddon to come, then their lord Jesus would return to establish his kingdom. They're trying to make Jesus come back "faster" one might say, and their philosophy goes hand in hand with Zionism (actually the Evangelicals are funding Zionism more than Jewish people are).

I would be very careful to differentiate Jews and Zionists, being a Jew does not necessarily make you a Zionist.

As for the poll, I said no. America is simply a country run by Christians and Jews at the moment. In the long future it could be anyone else, it all depends on who's on top economically.



 

and being a Msulim doesnt atomatically make you a terrorist, but if I said so you would jump all over me, nice double standard.  Jews are influential in the financial market but not so much in politics, if they were you could bet America would be alot more secualr (and better off )  I wish Jews were in charge of America, they would do a much better job than the current people do!

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I have learned to hold popular opinion of no value."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 21:36
Originally posted by Tobodai Tobodai wrote:

Originally posted by Turk Turk wrote:

Originally posted by Tobodai Tobodai wrote:

hmm I see we have some people who have the same views as neo nazis..wonderfull


I love how some people use the label "nazi" or "extremist" to defend ridiculous state policies...

Anyway, America is run by Evangelicals who think there has to be a war, and Jerusalem in Jewish hands for the Armageddon to come, then their lord Jesus would return to establish his kingdom. They're trying to make Jesus come back "faster" one might say, and their philosophy goes hand in hand with Zionism (actually the Evangelicals are funding Zionism more than Jewish people are).

I would be very careful to differentiate Jews and Zionists, being a Jew does not necessarily make you a Zionist.

As for the poll, I said no. America is simply a country run by Christians and Jews at the moment. In the long future it could be anyone else, it all depends on who's on top economically.



 

and being a Msulim doesnt atomatically make you a terrorist, but if I said so you would jump all over me, nice double standard.  Jews are influential in the financial market but not so much in politics, if they were you could bet America would be alot more secualr (and better off )  I wish Jews were in charge of America, they would do a much better job than the current people do!



1. Jews are very influential in politics (see #2)
2. The financial market, in which Jews prosper, RUNS American politics
3. Jews fo not have secular tendencies at all. Look at Israel, which is a fundamentalist / theocratic state. In the secular regard you'd be much better off with Turks .
4. I think your wish has come true.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Mar-2005 at 21:47

Jews are very secular in America at least, even in Israel over 50% of hte people are atheists, thus if I had a religious connotation to any country it would be Israel, but I dont care much for Israel as a state so no.  I bet they dont teach youo how atheistic Israel is in the school of Islamadan Islamasaur thought now do they?

Trust me, if Jews controlled America we would know it, and things would be way better than they are now for America and the world, but a garuntee a person can only suceed in politics in AMerica as a jew in certain restricted locales of the country.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Infidel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Mar-2005 at 13:11

Originally posted by Tobodai Tobodai wrote:

Trust me, if Jews controlled America we would know it, and things would be way better than they are now for America and the world

And why is that? I had no idea that the jews had special inherited skills for fair policies and government? I thought it was just for business...

Quote but I guarantee a person can only suceed in politics in America as a jew in certain restricted locales of the country.

Please. Next thing you know, they're claiming descrimination. As far as I understand, being jew was kind of en vogue or fashion in the US. Suddenly they were popping up from everywhere...

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