Faith and Humanity

The concept of "burial" is interesting in itself.

Why have we always had burial rights

Well hygiene was definitly one reason that Janusrook mentioned. But then we are human, and you only have to ask yourself really. If you took out the religious ideas in your mind, even spiritual ones, your still going to want to do something with the body of a family member or friend. Humans like the idea thatthe person we love is always comfortable, even in death, and we have the desire to still take care of them. It really goes against our conscience and emotions to leave someone we care about behind.

So it's a desire and want in burying our relatives that goes back atLEAST 40,000 and definitly further back. Over time it became a ritual, in either case it eases the mind knowing you didn't leave your your relative to the elements and animals.

And before anyone asks, "Well what about the sky burial?" because I know some people on this forum like to pull that sort of thing, it's obvious that it's a custom that came about through neccesity to do something with bodies. After all, it's just about comforting the mind more then anything.

"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey

Cezar

Then if I don't have faith I totally lack spirituality?

That's not for me to say, faith and spirituality are personal, I or anybody else can't dictate to you what you should or shouldn't believe, its a private matter.

Cezar

First, what's that about humans creation? You think we were created?

Well we havn't always existed, at some point we were created.

Cezar

Then, what faith? Maybe you say that ancient people worshiped nature. Again I see it as a side result of conservation instinct. They were trying to avoid being harmed.

The creater created everything, so if nature created us its the work of the creater.

“What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.”
Albert Pine

Bulldog wrote:

Gcle

Those aren't the only two possibilities. There's reincarnation for a start. There's also Hades which is neither heaven nor hell nor extinction.

And there are many varieties of 'heaven'.

The concept of reincarnation includes heaven aswell, we reincarnate untill we reach a spiritual level high enough to enter as the Hindus call "Loka".

There are different interpretations of "heaven" but they share a common point which is being another world.

It would be better then to use the term 'other world'. 'Heaven' has many specific connotations, including being a pleasant place.

Actually I'd have no objection to saying there are two possibilities: "There is an afterlife" and "There is not an afterlife". Though you'd have to raise the question of whether there is a 'beforelife' or not.

Citizen of Ankh-Morpork
Never believe anything until it has been officially denied - Sir Humphrey Appleby, 1984.

SearchAndDestroy wrote:

Speaking of a creator, there could be one, but there doesn't have to be a religion and thats what I'm getting at. If some religions don't have a creator or a being of superiority of the all ruling, then is not something we were born self-consciencious of, and thus religion would be invention.

Buddhism gets on very well with the idea of an eternal, uncreated, universe, and has no 'being of superiority of the all ruling'. Anybody can be a Buddha, given time and right thought, right living and so forth.

Many animist religions have no concept of a single creator, or of a creation for that matter.

In fact you'll have to look at animism to find the origins of religion since that's the oldest of all religious beliefs.

Citizen of Ankh-Morpork
Never believe anything until it has been officially denied - Sir Humphrey Appleby, 1984.

SearchAndDestroy wrote:

gcle wrote:

Buddhism gets on very well with the idea of an eternal, uncreated, universe, and has no 'being of superiority of the all ruling'. Anybody can be a Buddha, given time and right thought, right living and so forth.

Many animist religions have no concept of a single creator, or of a creation for that matter.

In fact you'll have to look at animism to find the origins of religion since that's the oldest of all religious beliefs.

Thanks for the info on Buddhism. I think that shows that humans aren't born with the idea of a supernatural being in mind, but is passed on by culture.

Buddhism does have supernatural beings (at least many branches of it). It just doesn't need a creator, and they're not seen as all-powerful. Depends a bit what you mean by supernatural beings or course - it's more like Christians or whatever also believing in fairies and elves.

To this day many Shamans in central Asia still believe in animism and ancestral spirits from what I understand. Do these religions stretch back thousands of years before written religion? I was always curious about them in that regard. With written religion we have a good idea of the age they are, but with Shamanism and such, I never really see a age put on them.

The information we have is I guess almost totally from anthropological studies of 'uncivilised' and pre-literate tribes, especially hunter-gatherer ones, which is why animism is seen as a precursor belief system. There are still pockets of such peoples in various parts of the world, including in Asia, Australia and Africa, and probably parts of the Americas. There are strong traces of animism in ancient Greek and Roman religious beliefs.

What is common is the belief that people, animals, and indeed plants and places have souls, and are to some degree at least conscious (and all should therefore be respected). Of course you can believe that and still believe the universe was created by something or someone, but it isn't necessary, and does seem to be a later development (as indeed is the concept of gods in general).

Citizen of Ankh-Morpork
Never believe anything until it has been officially denied - Sir Humphrey Appleby, 1984.