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Forum LockedBelief in an Afterlife

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Oct-2005 at 12:35
Eternal sleep, eh? You mean vanishing by all means without a turnback forever?

If that's what you believe, then you should be very sorry when someone you loved dies.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Oct-2005 at 13:52
Sorry for myself for losing my relative yes... sorry for them i can't say the same because I wouldn't know for sure if they are completely extinguished or "went" somewhere else.
We humans have to consider the possibility that life wasn't created for us to enjoy or created for a purpose after all. Everything that we have created religion, material possession, empires, ideas have been created exclusively to serve us. However all these things are also impermanent and constantly changing. Life could be the same... if its made to serve someone it might be just as the thing that we have created... impermanent and changing.
The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mangudai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Oct-2005 at 07:15
To me life after death is a matter of course. According to physics, energy can't be destroyed. So how could our life-energy be destroyed and cease to exist just because our bodies die? No to me, there are plenty of evidence that the soul lives on in some form or another
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arch.buff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Oct-2005 at 20:32
Well, im a christian so my answer should mirror that. in short, i do believe there is a afterlife and that when we die we will either go to heaven or hell, simple as that. The one thing I dont get about atheists is that they believe we are here on Earth for no other reason then to reproduce? sounds a lil too simple for me, but maybe some atheists out there can elaborate. So basically to non-believers our lives are as imporatnt as a cow we slaughter to make McDonalds hamburgers out of?? seeing as from their point of you view we both dont have souls and are simply here to reproduce.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Oct-2005 at 20:52
Originally posted by Le Renard Le Renard wrote:

I believe in the afterlife.  If you think about it for a second.. Why would we be here if there was no plan for us once we died.  We are eternal beings.  Just think about that.


Why would we not be here if there is no plan at all? Life is pretty absurd: people life to work instead of working for living, justice seems to be nowhere, freedom may well be limited to choose between Pepsi and Coke, truth... well, you see how hard is to come to any relevant conclussion that is accepted as truthful by all.

We are not eternal beings: we were born and before that there was no me/you. There can well be a future time when there's no me/you again and the order of things is restored (without me/you).

The only reason I doubt is because Astrology. Else I would be plainly atheist/materialist. But even if Astrology works, that may mean nothing at all: there could be material laws behind or be one of those subtle phenomena whose physical principles we are as unable to understand so far as a dog is unable to understand quantum mechanics or a film.

We could also well be space-temporal manifestations of something much "larger" than us, call it God if you wish. And as anything in space-time we are ephimerous while the greater being that we are too is not ephimerous at all but also is unable to manifest in our universe but through us.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Oct-2005 at 20:54
Originally posted by Barış Barış wrote:

Eternal sleep, eh? You mean vanishing by all means without a turnback forever?

If that's what you believe, then you should be very sorry when someone you loved dies.


Not necessarily. As some philosopher pointed out long ago, there's no such big diference between being alive or dead. Being alive may not be so important after all. I do worry about suffering and pain but hardly about death.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Oct-2005 at 20:59
Originally posted by arch.buff arch.buff wrote:

Well, im a christian so my answer should mirror that. in short, i do believe there is a afterlife and that when we die we will either go to heaven or hell, simple as that. The one thing I dont get about atheists is that they believe we are here on Earth for no other reason then to reproduce? sounds a lil too simple for me, but maybe some atheists out there can elaborate. So basically to non-believers our lives are as imporatnt as a cow we slaughter to make McDonalds hamburgers out of?? seeing as from their point of you view we both dont have souls and are simply here to reproduce.  


We must clearly consider that we are here for nothing, at least as a possibility. Most of what people do seem so meaningless anyhow.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ottoman Emperor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-Oct-2005 at 21:04
  So you think.  We do many important things.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 09:33
Originally posted by Ottoman Emperor Ottoman Emperor wrote:

  So you think.  We do many important things.


Like what?

Importance is in the eyes of whoever looks. In the long run, everything is futile.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 10:22
Originally posted by Maju Maju wrote:

Importance is in the eyes of whoever looks. In the long run, everything is futile.

I totally agree!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vulkan02 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 11:03
Plus we have spread out like rats and this reinforces the view that it might just be meaningless because just like the shells at sea, the ants in the ground and pretty much everything else we just replicate ourselves.
The beginning of a revolution is in reality the end of a belief - Le Bon
Destroy first and construction will look after itself - Mao
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote honeybee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Nov-2005 at 21:19

"no it does not exist, but if it did I would much rather go to the hell version as all the cool people are there I wouldnt wan t to go to heaven and hang oout with all the boring people and goody two shoes. "

 

What are you talking about? There are plenty of evidence for afterlife.

http://www.victorzammit.com/book/index.html

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Infidel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Nov-2005 at 21:58

I have a strong belief in life after death purely based on what it can be based: faith. And I can tell you it is a much more comforting and rewarding thought than just believing that you cease to exist as your bodies dies.

I'm not criticizing those people who don't believe in LAD. Each one believes in whatever suits him/her well. As for the evidence or not of an afterlife, it's the same as for God - There is no scientific fact that proves it and there's no scientific fact that disproves it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vamun Tianshu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Nov-2005 at 22:22

I believe and don't believe in an afterlife.I may be athiest,but my atheism is pretty much a different view than most of the athiests on this forum.Thats why I consider myself,"A Unique Athiest".

Anyway,The Afterlife which I believe in is different than religious afterlife.It is divided by how you die.Murder,Suicide,Natural Disease,Natural Causes,Old Age,Child Birth,etc.By how you die,you go on a different course.Suicides are pained to see how their life could've been had they not kill themselves.Old Age people get to see their family grow,Murdered people get to basically see life continue without them.My afterlife is dark and gritty,and their is no light.Only for the ones who have proved themselves worthful in life can truly have a rewarding afterlife,like having the opportunity to visit what they changed as spirits.The people who never got to live their dreams haunt the Earth with their ghastly presence.

I am a paranormalist.I believe we are born to serve ourselves,and not serve some fictional higher being,or kings,or queens or prophets.We are here because we are here,either to create,destroy,desecrate,decimate,obliterate,whatever.And because I am considered by many to be a Animal Rights Radicalist,I consider Animal Lives to be as important as Human Lives,since they are alive,and we are alive,and I don't think we are superior.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote honeybee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Nov-2005 at 23:16
 "have a strong belief in life after death purely based on what it can be based: faith. And I can tell you it is a much more comforting and rewarding thought than just believing that you cease to exist as your bodies dies.

I'm not criticizing those people who don't believe in LAD. Each one believes in whatever suits him/her well. As for the evidence or not of an afterlife, it's the same as for God - There is no scientific fact that proves it and there's no scientific fact that disproves it."

 

There are plenty of scientific evidence for afterlife, but not for God. Reincarnation is well studied by Ian Stevenson, one of the most well known scientist of the time. Through strict scientific procedure he is able to trace memories of children to their previous life with amazing accuracy and detail. Frauds are highly improbable for the reason provided since there are no rewards or fame given, in fact the families that are asked is quite annoyed at Stevenson, I say its more than just blind faith, it requires prove.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mixcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Nov-2005 at 13:03
Originally posted by Infidel Infidel wrote:

And I can tell you it is a much more comforting and rewarding thought than just believing that you cease to exist as your bodies dies.

not necessarily. I think it's more comforting to believe that you cease to exist when you die than being afraid you won't go to heaven but to hell.
"Some argue that atheism partly stems from a failure to fairly and judiciously consider the facts"
"Atheists deny the existence of Satan, while simultaneously doing his work."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Infidel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Nov-2005 at 18:01
Ok, let me rephrase it then. It is much more comforting and rewarding to me that there's life after death. God gives the answer to the mystery of existence.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Nov-2005 at 02:09
I think belief in the afterlife is the only way humans have to deal with the disbelief that comes with the pain of death. In most societies, death is looked upon in a negative way. I dont believe that death is a negative thing, because it is part of life. When someone i know dies (like my grandmother a couple of years ago), i know that they are gone forever and I will never see them again. I enjoyed our moments and her memory will live with me, but thats about it. Sorry to break it to you guys, but death is just as beautiful as birth and life; it is the completion of our temoporary journey in this reality.

It would be nice to have an afterlife though. Whether there is one or not, or whether we will simply be reincarnated, i dont know. Im not ruling out the possibility, i just wouldnt bet on it.


Edited by ArmenianSurvival
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Quetzalcoatl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Nov-2005 at 02:50

Originally posted by Mangudai Mangudai wrote:

To me life after death is a matter of course. According to physics, energy can't be destroyed. So how could our life-energy be destroyed and cease to exist just because our bodies die? No to me, there are plenty of evidence that the soul lives on in some form or another

 

Yet no man enters the same river twice, nor a river is entered twice by the same person; which means you aren't the same person that you were just a second ago and you are radically different from the baby you once were. The atoms of a body only belong to that particular body for short time; the body should be viewed at as fluid rather than a solid>This means you've already died many times unbeknown to you--all that is left is the memories, yet even that can be destroyed or altered.

 

So when you say you believe in the afterlife, what do you people expect to survive?

 



Edited by Quetzalcoatl
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maju Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Nov-2005 at 04:51
Originally posted by Quetzalcoatl Quetzalcoatl wrote:

Originally posted by Mangudai Mangudai wrote:

To me life after death is a matter of course. According to physics, energy can't be destroyed. So how could our life-energy be destroyed and cease to exist just because our bodies die? No to me, there are plenty of evidence that the soul lives on in some form or another

 

Yet no man enters the same river twice, nor a river is entered twice by the same person; which means you aren't the same person that you were just a second ago and you are radically different from the baby you once were. The atoms of a body only belong to that particular body for short time; the body should be viewed at as fluid rather than a solid>This means you've already died many times unbeknown to you--all that is left is the memories, yet even that can be destroyed or altered.



Excellent observation, Quetzacoatl. It's truly a paradox worrying about afterlife when we just can barely recall our first years for instance. Even is something would survive the lack of memory/conscience makes that something a diferent thing from what I used to be, becoming therefore another being.

Also, on Mangudai's negentropist comment: when you die worms, funghi or other "cleaners" get your energy. Some dissipates as heat, of course.

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