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Forum LockedBattles of Iwo Jima and Okinawa

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    Posted: 04-Mar-2007 at 11:45
In the battle of Iwo Jima and Okinawa, American had a heavy lost. But i think was it necessary to land.At that time, Japanese lost all of their fleet, no navy could crushed the Us fleet. So american could simply surrounded these islands, bombed them, then Japanese would lose their fighting power since running of food and clean water, no needed to land, what do you think?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hermeslyre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Mar-2007 at 16:16
Well the United States must have had a reason to land... on Iwa Jima the Japanese had created deep bunkers to the surprise of the Americans.. And i'm sure We wanted a very quick end to the war in the pacific. The process of slowly bleeding the Japanese to surrender may have took to long in our leaders eyes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tommy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 08:44
They feared that Russian would come to join the Pacific War and extended their power,So UNited States  wanted a quick end of the war?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hermeslyre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 11:36
There were probably other reasons but yes, The US probably predicted future conflict with The Soviet Union and wanted to call as much territory as possible theirs. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aghart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 17:49
 Also there are problems in maintaining a fleet at sea for very long periods, even the USA with it's huge resources and superb logistical expertise would have found difficulty in maintaining a blockade of Okinawa in particular for a period of months.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 18:23
Neither Iwo or Okinawa were about maintaining fleet facilities.  Neither had infrastructure nor room for substantial naval dockyards and logististics.  The use of these territories had to do with the assault on the Japanese mainland....by air and by invasion.
 
The invasion of the Japanese islands was scheduled for late 1945 (Kyushu) and March, 1946 (Honshu - Tokyo/Yokahama).  The continuing air assault on Japanese targets would benefit from both locations, and the preparation for invasion required a large land area to marshal and prepare forces sufficient for the task.  Similar to England's position in Europe.
 
Okinawa and Iwo Jima both could have hosted air forces for the Japanese that might be used for kamikaze attacks against US naval forces.  Ultimately, those kamikaze were less than decisive, but nobody knew that in 1945.
 
Anyway, that is my read on it.  The bomb, and the Russian redeployment to Asia after Germany's surrender changed the equation.  There has been some revisionist thinking that the invasion of (at least) Iwo was unnecessary, but in the context of 1945, that does not hold water.
 
  


Edited by pikeshot1600 - 05-Mar-2007 at 18:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 22:53

Note that American death rates and sunk ships increased after Japanese lost all their navy. Why? Kamakazi.

     
   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hermeslyre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 23:50
Originally posted by pekau pekau wrote:

Note that American death rates and sunk ships increased after Japanese lost all their navy. Why? Kamakazi.



Yes but the devine wind wasnt near as successful as the japanese would have hoped...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05-Mar-2007 at 23:54

I meant the sucide aircraft fighters, not the natural disasters... (Though the name literally means as you have mentioned. It was, of course, not enough to stop the Americans to dominate the Pacific Ocean and dropping atomic bomb in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. But the message was clear. Japan would never surrender by foreigners, and Americans had to deploy atomic bombs to quickly end the war. To prevent more American deaths, and to prevent more excuses for Stalin to move the troops to Far East.

     
   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tommy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2007 at 06:39
But how about using submarines to blockade these two islands
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Mar-2007 at 06:39
Iwo Jima was needed to have an emergency airfield on which to land B29s on their return trip.  The plans that were made did not include or account for the A bomb,  it was still top secret and not known if it would actually work.  So everything went as if we would be invading the Japanese mainland.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crusader3943 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Mar-2007 at 10:39
The US was always eager for a fight with the Japs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Mar-2007 at 19:39
Originally posted by Crusader3943 Crusader3943 wrote:

The US was always eager for a fight with the Japs.
 
 
I don't know where your information came from but, from 1918 to 1941 the US was almost totally isolationist.  The idea of getting into a fight with any country was, if not non existing, rare.
At the outbreak of WWII US Army was ranked 16th in size, weapons and general readiness.  The Navy was ranked 5-6, not exactly what you would expect from a country spoiling for a fight.   


Edited by red clay - 12-Mar-2007 at 19:40
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Mar-2007 at 21:30
Originally posted by Crusader3943 Crusader3943 wrote:

The US was always eager for a fight with the Japs.
 
Nope. Read more about Japanese-American relations before Pearl Harbour.
     
   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crusader3943 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Mar-2007 at 14:55
Originally posted by pekau pekau wrote:

Originally posted by Crusader3943 Crusader3943 wrote:

The US was always eager for a fight with the Japs.

 

Nope. Read more about Japanese-American relations before Pearl Harbour.


sorry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timotheus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2007 at 22:39
There are some people who say that Roosevelt wanted to join WWII to support the British but could not find a good excuse so ignored lots of evidence that the Japanese were planning an attack. I classify that with "Bush knew 9/11 was going to happen but he wanted to invade Iraq": probably not true. The evidence was there, but nobody could find it, correlate it, and make the right conclusions in time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pekau Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Mar-2007 at 22:51
Originally posted by Crusader3943 Crusader3943 wrote:

Originally posted by pekau pekau wrote:

Originally posted by Crusader3943 Crusader3943 wrote:

The US was always eager for a fight with the Japs.

 

Nope. Read more about Japanese-American relations before Pearl Harbour.


sorry
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DukeC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2007 at 01:33
Like Red Clay says Iwo Jima was needed as an emergency landing strip for B-29s and it also based P-51s that escorted the bombers over Japan. The 25,000 Japanese on Iwo had years to prepare and the whole island was honey-combed by tunnels and strong-points. If the U.S. could have bypassed it they would have, they didn't lose 6,000 Marines there for the hell of it.
 
Okinawa was needed as a base for the planned invasion of Japan in the fall of 1945. It wasn't known if the Manhattan Project would be successful, and a forward base was needed close to the Japanese main islands. Okinawa was the best option.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sparten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 04:03
I thnk Iwo was a mistake. Far better to have gone to Formosa as the Army wanted.
 
As for Okinawa it was definatly necessary. And with about 20,000 KIA and over a 100,000 causlties a very expensive one.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Mar-2007 at 08:48
Originally posted by Sparten Sparten wrote:

I thnk Iwo was a mistake. Far better to have gone to Formosa as the Army wanted.
 

As for Okinawa it was definatly necessary. And with about 20,000 KIA and over a 100,000 causlties a very expensive one.

 




The wisdom of attacking Iwo will be debated forever, however the one aspect that can't be overlooked is that it was thought of as one of the Japanese home Islands, so for the first time we were actually attacking Japan itself.
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