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Forum LockedAncient Peoples DNA

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Barbapapa View Drop Down
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    Posted: 29-May-2009 at 23:23
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:16
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Vorian View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vorian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 21:24
How on earth can they find racial DNA? We can only talk about phenotypes and such not Germanic or Hellenic or Phoenician DNA. ANd let's not get started on the "Macedonian" one....Thumbs Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 22:01
This looks  weird. The only real way to do those comparisons would be detailed comparison of genetical markers of modern  nations with those of the past. This is possible but requires a lot of labour and money. As far as I know it wasn't done yet apart from rare cases. Was this study published somewhere?
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 23:12
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:16
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 23:29
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:16
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2009 at 23:58
Originally posted by Barbapapa Barbapapa wrote:

 
A lot of companies already found that genes are blocked by language barriers and even more by cultural barriers.

means: a mutation spreads pretty well inside a region of identical language but does very hard flow into a region with different language and extremely hard flow into a region with different culture.

In 90% of the cases people are genetically closer related to people who live 1000km away and speak the same language than to people who live 100km away but speak a different language.
 
I wouldn't generalize it so much. Look at the following sudies:
 
 
Distribution of many other markers also contradict to what you are saying. Look for instance different marker compositions in different slavonic nations.


Edited by Anton - 31-May-2009 at 00:01
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 00:04
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:16
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 01:14
Originally posted by Barbapapa Barbapapa wrote:


But let me guess, your Slavonic nationalist?
then possibly you could call me brother because of my haplogroupTongue
Am I what? Smile
Anyway, I still think that systematic studies done with DNA extracted from Ancient remains were not performed, although they are obviously important for understanding population movements.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 01:59
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:17
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 02:57
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:20
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 03:13
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:21
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 12:10
Originally posted by Barbapapa Barbapapa wrote:


They claim they did and that they are the only ones who did. So you claim they are lyers and make this up. ;)

Well, the company is not a nobody.
German TV doctumentaries about DNA research quote them.
I know at least 4 German newspapers/magazines that made an interview with them about this.
And they are kind of national heros of FYROM (ROFL...for claiming that FYROM is 30% Macedonian) and national enemies of Greece (for claiming that FYROM is only 15% Slavonic while any greek child learns in school that FYROMS are 100% slavonic).

if they are lyers and sharlatans, then they are quiet well known ones who preached their lies in the mass media. (wich is not very smart if you know exactly you tell shit)

Right? ;)

 
I do not say they are liers and charlatans. But I would prefer to read the publication in a peer reviewed journal (like for instance Human Molecular Genetics or similar type), so that I can see where did samples come from; how were they discovered;  based on what arguments were they classified as Ancient Celts, Macedonians, Thracians, Slavs; how systematic was the study was etc.etc.etc. Untill that I will reserve some doubts about this study.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 18:58
How come Belorus is always the same colour?
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Never believe anything until it has been officially denied - Sir Humphrey Appleby, 1984.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 19:26
Hi Barbarossa, welcome to AE! Smile I remember your posts in Heavengames from 7 and 8 years ago!
 
What is your idea about it:
 


Edited by Cyrus Shahmiri - 31-May-2009 at 19:52
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 22:30
I saw this about a year ago...The namings like Vorian said are a joke. Just look at the "Wikinger", "Germaner" in Skandinavia.... Trust me, the Skandinavians have done plenty of research before this Igenea. And where are the Samis btw? LOL In Scandinavia, we have a lot of Sami herritage as well, but it seems those guys haven't heard about it.

Also, just Bulgaria is marked as Thrakier (I have never heard this term in Genetics). So, what about Romania? What about Serbia? What about western Turkey?

It is amuzing!
I suggest you rely mostly on internationally respected organizations like this http://https://genographic.nationalgeographic.com/genographic/atlas.html

otherwise you'll find companies that will make you a martian or a Klingon in order to get your money.


Edited by Flipper - 31-May-2009 at 22:33


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31-May-2009 at 23:47
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:21
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2009 at 00:24
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:28
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbapapa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2009 at 06:03
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Edited by Barbapapa - 08-Jun-2009 at 15:18
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2009 at 08:40
Originally posted by Barbapapa Barbapapa wrote:

Belarus is always the same color, because there is no data about it.
Green = no Data avaible about this country.

Quote And where are the Samis btw?

On the "Diverse" map.

Finland: 8% Sami.
I however wonder too, why there is not even 1% Sami in Norway or Sweden. ;)



Yes, it is impossible not to find Sami DNA amongst Swedes. I mean, one of the most typical characteristics I recognize on Scandinavians is the upper cheeks, which is evident influence from the Samis. Even 8% in Finland (where an Uralic language like the Sami is being spoken) is too little. Also, Wikinger as it says means Svear, Götar and other minor tribes that all together equal Germanic. If you ask me, it's crap based on what i've seen so far. Have a look for example on the Atlas of the human journey i posted earlier. It shows in detail the chromosomes found in every nation, which nations have common chromosomes, how they've moved, where they came from etc. Furthermore, it agrees with whatever DNA report i've seen so far.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calvo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jun-2009 at 09:57
The study of DNA has certainly revolutionised our knowledge of human ancestry and migration patterns.
Nevertheless, many extremists also use the same data for manipulation purposes; so before believing in any articles published on the internet, always think twice about the reliability of the source. As a fact, many, if not most personal blogs about "anthropology" are not published by true anthropologists, but by racists or extreme nationalists to try to convince the public of their biological agenda through manipulation of scientific facts.

I'm not saying that what you've published is wrong, it's just a cautionary note.

So far, I've heard many contradicting versions of the same study with the same data; one of which is regarding the percentage of North African and Near Eastern markers in the Iberian peninsula. Some studies yielded a low 2% while other yielded a high 30%. Knowing the exact truth is probably a very complex procedure.
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